WTH did I do?

[WileyXB12X]

06 XB12X, 9500 mi, breather mod

I changed the oil, filter and transmission fluid today, all things I've done before with no problem.

I clean the bike and take it out to make sure everything's normal. After about 10 minutes, the idle increases so I'm sitting at a stoplight at just under 2K rpms, vibrating the **** out of my arms. I start heading home, go to stop at a grocery store, my idle comes back down to normal and then the bike just dies. I coast into a parking spot.

I get what I need and come back out to see if it will start and starts just fine. I kick it in gear, idle is back to normal, check engine light comes on and I finesse a couple blocks out of the bike to get home.

All the fluid levels are where they should be, so I didn't blow oil or transmission lubricant anywhere. Everything 'seems' to be intact.

So what did I do to foul my bike?

[sparky300]

CEL is still on? Check the codes

[WileyXB12X]

Yeah, CEL is still on.

Is there a way to check the codes without the thingamajig?

[anrkizm95]

DDFI Trouble Codes
http://www.bcrider.com/DDFI.html

Code No. Fault Condition
11 Throttle position sensor
13 Oxygen sensor
14 Engine temperature sensor
15 Intake air temperature sensor
16 Battery voltage
21 inter active muffler control
23 Front fuel injector
24 Front ignition coil
25 Rear ignition coil
26,27 clutch and neutral switch
32 Rear fuel injector
33 Fuel pump
34 iac
35 Tachometer
36 fan voltage
37,43 speed sensor
44 Bank angle sensor
45 side stand sensor
46 start relay
47 aux power outlets
52, 53, 54, 55 ECM failure
56 Cam sync failure

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/6369_20110804152501_L.jpg

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/6369_20110728113824_L.jpg

[WileyXB12X]

Thanks!

Codes 11, 16 and 21. Awesome.[confused]

[Lesley]

I bet you got something wet. You stated that you cleaned it. Does that mean spraying with water? Give it a day or so and I bet it dries out. Good luck

[WileyXB12X]

I hope that's all it is, but not the first time the bike has had a bath. HA!

I have read on multiple posts that the codes will stay in your bike pretty much indefinitely. A month or so back I had a dead battery and replaced it, so that would explain 16.

Still no clue for 11 or 21 though. I found some threads indicating something as simple as a blown fuse can cause 21, apparently it's on the same circuit with the horn and brake light, but all the fuses are good. Hmmm...

[Lesley]

I hope that's all it is, but not the first time the bike has had a bath.

You can never second guess an electrical short. Haha I just suspect water is the culprit,maybe not though. Best of luck

[WileyXB12X]

I went out to start it today and see, the engine started then as soon as I gave it a little gas it would die. I did this a couple of times and on the third time a little smoke came out from the air box. ?

[WileyXB12X]

So I was thinking more about what Lesley said and here's my theory - tell me if it jives with the problem I'm having.

None of the maintenance I did 'should' have interfered with the fuel system, but water could definitely be the problem, but maybe more than just getting into a few connections.

I have a CIA airbox cover with the larger intake ports in the front. Normally, I plug these with a couple rags before I wash the bike and I forgot to when I cleaned it on Saturday. So more water than your average rainstorm could have gotten into the airbox. The short ride I took could have sloshed it around enough to get through the filter and down into the air intake, putting water in the least desirable place.

Does this sound like it could be the source of my problem? If so, is there a way I can test it to be sure that the problem is water in the engine? And follow-up, if that's my problem, should I start with just spraying some carb cleaner into the intake and put some heet in a full tank of gas and see if that solves it or should I just go ahead and dismantle the carb and clean it?

Thanks again for all your feedback.

[heagachongoose]

should I just go ahead and dismantle the carb and clean it?

[confused] good luck finding the carb

I'm thinking water would most likely be the culprit. The only thing that seriously concerns me is te smoke coming out of the airbox, which is hopefully just water vapor.

[WileyXB12X]

good luck finding the carb

Yeah, I'm a dunce. I meant the throttle body but had mentioned using carb cleaner so the word was stuck in my head. But I'm a novice when it comes to wrenching, no doubt about that.

Talking to some others who are more skilled than me, they suspect that the smoke from the air intake was just unburned fuel from when it backfired in the throttlebody. They recommended spraying some throttle body cleaner (is that the smae as carb cleaner?) inside and letting it evaporate just to be sure.

I've also found threads where people have similiar symptoms stemming from a cracked ECM from the seat being on it and water getting inside. So I'm going to check that too. If none of that works, I'll be getting a cable and downloading ECMspy to try a TPS reset. After that, the stealership is my final option.

[WileyXB12X]

I checked the new oil level, the level was fine but it was very milky - so somehow moisture got in there too. Going to drain, flush with some cheap oil and change again.

Pulled the spark plugs, the nut was rusted but the gap was fine other than a little blackened on both. Changing those out as well, but first I'll give it a couple turns to clear them out if necessary.

Finally, going to dump some Heet in the gas tank and see if that helps.

ECM appears intact but I'm going to pull it off and look at the underside as well. I'm not sure how to test the TPS to see if it's working correctly without taking it to the shop.

I really don't know what I'm doing, just chasing down everything that 'could' be wrong.

[WileyXB12X]

New spark plugs, flushed the oil, same problem, sputters, pops, back fires in the throttle body. If I give it a lot of gas I can keep it going, if I just roll on the throttle as if I were riding, it dies. TPS?

Muffler control servo is definitely shot. It wasn't moving the way I had seen before so I opened it up the the plastic is broke. Good times, but not sure if that's the 'source' of my problems.

[lawdog]

If you need a new muffler servo I can send you mine.

[WileyXB12X]

If you need a new muffler servo I can send you mine.

I'll take it.

[lawdog]

Cost the shipping costs and I will throw it in the mail today for you.
Brett

[WileyXB12X]

Made a donation for ECMspy, just have to get the cable and see what else I can break.

[WileyXB12X]

Drained the gas today to rule out bad gas. New gas in it, still no joy. It sputters and pops in the throttle body. I can hold the throttle at one spot and it will rev up on its own, like it's getting more gas when I'm not telling it to get more gas. Is this more and more indicative of a bad TPS or just a need for a TPS reset?

[WileyXB12X]

No joy. I did a TPS reset per the manual and Dave's videos. Still sputters and dies. Then it stopped starting all together. The starter clicks but it won't catch.

[Macbuell]

Faulty ground cause this? Tighten up all wires. Worth a shot.

[sparky300]

Check & tighten the battery terminals. Do a load test on the battery, I believe output when running should be north of 12.4 vdc?

[Jasenko9643]

"06 XB12X, 9500 mi, breather mod"

you state breather mod? what do you mean you installed a catch can? cut holes on your intake box?
anyhow undo your mod and see what happens

[WileyXB12X]

I let it sit on the tender overnight and it starts again, must have just drained it with it on for the TPS reset and multiple start attempts. Still won't idle, sputters and backfires in the throttle body.

I have the CIA air box cover, holes in the air box, and a catch can - all installed about 3000 miles ago with no problems until now.

Could bad engine timing be the cause of my problems?

[Macbuell]

I let it sit on the tender overnight and it starts again, must have just drained it with it on for the TPS reset and multiple start attempts.Â* Still won't idle, sputters and backfires in the throttle body.

That is not a fix for a bad ground... you should still look for a bad ground. LIsten to sparky-


Check & tighten the battery terminals. Do a load test on the battery, I believe output when running should be north of 12.4 vdc?

[sparky300]

look for a bad ground


Yep. Totally unrelated but I lost all my lights once... turns, cluster, headlights, when all 4 ground terminals broke at the ground screw under the lower triple. Check ALL your grounds

[WileyXB12X]

I hear what you're saying - do you think a faulty ground would cause all the other problems I'm having (no idle, backfire in the throttle body, etc)?

[lawdog]

If the ecm is not getting the proper voltage then the bike will run horrible. Not enough power to properly measure sensors, control fuel injectors etc. So battery troubles can affect the engine.

I would definitely test the battery and charging system. Do a load test on the battery with key off. Run the bike and do a load test with the bike running. You may have a bad battery, bad ground, wire, connection, etc. Or bad component of the charging system.

[WileyXB12X]

Thanks. I'll start checking everything out tonight when I get home. Luckily I just had the fly screen off and I checked those wires, they're good, so that leaves the rest of the bike to check out.

I do remember a little gouge in the rear spark plug cable coming off the coil where it looked like it had been rubbing through. Hmmm...

I can't do the load test with the bike running on account of I can't get it to run.

[WileyXB12X]

I went out and checked all the wires and grounds. I couldn't find anything obvious, nothing looks corroded or cracked other than the spark plug cable, but it wasn't worn through the sheath. The batter tested just shy of 12V after sitting on the tender.

I fired it up and got it warmed up by holding the throttle, it popped and backfired like a sonofabitch, I did that for about five minutes then let go - and it kept running. It held the idle at 1000 rpms for a few minutes, then spiked up to 2000 rpms and sat there for a few minutes, then sputted and died.

It started right up again so I figured what the hell and took it around the block a couple times. It was fairly smooth in the lower rpms for a while but any time I goosed it the engine would lag and start popping again and any time I came to a stop I kept on the throttle a bit to keep it from dying on me.

Improvement, I guess, but I have no idea why since I didn't really do anything to it. Still not reliable. I have an appointment at the mechanic this weekend, so I still have time to troubleshoot and cancel if we figure it out.


Thanks again for everybody who's taken a moment to give me advice and ideas to chase down.

[Mope]

Just another idea to troubleshoot - I ride with a guy who had almost identical issues a couple years ago to what you're describing.....ran with gas only and would sputter/die without, poor fueling causing smoke from TB, bucks like crazy if ridden while keeping on the throttle.

Spent 3 or 4 weekends trying to find the culprit. I suspected a electrical/ground issue because of the behavior and how common grounding issues are on our bikes. Finally, plopped in my extra ECM (same BIN) and she ran like a champ....which was better than finding something wrong in the harness. He had fried his ECM somehow. May not be worth buying a new one, but if you've got someone close with the same(ish) year you can confirm with TunerPro (or ECMSpy Mono if you bought that) if you have the same ECM and try it. Might solve the problem.....

[WileyXB12X]

Anybody in the Baltimore area with a 06 Uly ECM they'd be willing to swap for a check? HA!

[WileyXB12X]

Bike has been in the shop for a week now - they don't know what's wrong with it either.

[WileyXB12X]

So far, everybody was right.

Found an intake leak and replaced the gasket, a little better after that, but not perfect.

ECM was separated internally, but no visible crack on the outside. Replaced that and it would idle fine until it got warm.

Finally started throwing a TPS code, so they checked that and it was malfunctioning too. Replacing TPS now - we'll see if it's 100% after that. Their Buell specialist has been completely smitten with this puzzler.

[steve92106]

I'll be hoping you find a relatively minor (read: "cheap") solution to your problems as they sound an awful lot like mine. Hey maybe Buell built all these bikes with a planned lifespan so they'd all go to pieces at the same time and we'd all have to buy new replacements. Reading all these posts about poor idles, backfiring, surging, etc. sure doesn't make me feel good.

Had my bike serviced at 20k miles by the local HD dealer. Two weeks later I checked the oil level and it was below the dipstick! Filled it up and it hasn't budged since.

Resolved not to use the HD dealer so I had the forks overhauled by a SD area independent recommended by American Sportbike. The forks are fine but now I have a ding in my brake rotor that pulses when I brake hard.

Resolved not to use that independent. Now this!

[DrogeN Omen]

i had all those symptoms on my 2007 XB12SS last year. turned out a faulty wiring harness fried all my electrics, ecm, air intake sensor, tps sensor, battery.

I replaced them all and got an EBR ECM for $305 pre-tuned for a Drummer SS, runs like a champ now. have a flat spot at 5,500rpm in 4th & 5th gear but think its cause i have a custom built exhaust and its not fully straight through like the Drummer SS so om not getting enough flow.

suggest checking your ECM, air intake sensor, tps sensor and looking over your entire wiring harness for any fried wires, rubbing or cracks.

[WileyXB12X]

Got it back from the dealership yesterday after 4 weeks in the shop. They replaced the manifold gasket, TPS, ECM and one spark plug cable.

I still don't feel like it's 100%. It lets out a kind of "PUH" noise intermittently when cruising and when it's warm the RPM's tend to fluctuate at idle, but it starts, runs and stays running so I can go back to riding and commuting.