Range Rover Runs Over Bikers

[oh9bolt]

Discuss.

Liveleak Link (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=319_1380522846)

[06xbss]

Curious as to what the whole story is........ Just judging by what can be seen in the vid, don't **** with cars while on a bike.

[Loki]

I think the land rover at the beginning did something ignorant and pissed a rider off, then got scared and ran everyone over. Needless to say my hands are shaking after watching that from anger. I wanted to see that driver pounded. Wish we say him get pulled out and beat (not to death). **** with my friends and I will lose it is my mind set while riding.

Now dont get me wrong I dont blame him for being scared and running off. But I want to know what he did at the beginning to piss the riders off enough to pull him over, the ride did not look to be an aggressive nor stunty ride. As a rider If someone does something ignorant to me when riding and it was an accident on their part, a simple wave of the hand with a look of apology calms me down. Im guessing this was a driver who refused to back down to a bunch of "bikers."

Someone said in the comments that the driver was beat and killed... Im not sure but who knows. never piss off ANY large group of people, they tend to lose their minds.

[snrusnak]

Without knowing what happened it's hard to say. I don't know what compels people to ride like that but it doesn't look like the cager was at fault at first. If I had a gang of bikers around me I sure as hell wouldn't stop either I'd get the F out of there. Seems like they wanted to instigate him then retaliate. Not that he should have ran people over...

Loki the bikers were boxing him in and the one got right in front of him then let off and looks like the suv bumped him so they stopped him on the highway. I wouldn't stop either(although I'd try not to run people over lol). IMO that's the biker's fault not the driver's.

If you're stupid enough to ride like that right in front of and around a car on the highway, within a couple feet, knowing you're pissing them off, then honestly you deserve to get bumped(not ran over, but they were instigating).

[SEXT9]

The newspaper story found here: THE LINK (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2438620/Shocking-video-Range-Rover-crashing-bikers-surround-vehicle-annual-street-ride.html) states nobody was killed.

The video does appear to start a little late. Since the first biker in front of the Range Rover clearly swerves in front of it and is watching as he tries to slow it down. So it's hard to tell what happened to begin with. But, I do know the law works off of intent. The question is, what were those bikers intentions when they got the range rover stopped and blocked up 3 lanes of traffic? And the intention of the Range Rover driver is clear, to get out of there to protect himself and his family.

I'm sure several of them had cameras. Why couldn't they have documented what happened and gotten the license number of the SUV and reported it? I can't say I would find fault with the Range Rover driver. If it was me and my family in the car, I would've done whatever was necessary to protect them. They all should be glad in that situation nobody was carrying. Someone might have ended up shot.

[wolfo68]

Honestly it looks like the rover was trying to go through the bikes and that's why they boxed him in initially. It's hard to say with a lack of video before it happened though.

[snrusnak]

No one has been arrested and police are still investigating and examining the evidence, he said.
The spokesman said, according to the driver, a large number of motorcyclists were driving 'erratically' and he 'accidentally collided with one'.
The footage shows one motorcyclist brake hard in front the the car and seems to get bumped by it.
He pulled over but some of the bikers started to damage the vehicle. The NYPD spokesman told the Mail Online the driver drove off 'to avoid an impending assault'.


At least they didn't kill him. BS they didn't get arrested.

[jstfkndi]

Disgusting! No matter what the driver did, someone can pull over and call the cops. Not letting it go seems the biggest problem here and mob mentality seems to rule. What surprises me, is even after he ran over several bikes, they chased him down and there were probably more accidents caused to each other in the silly swarm they started. Understand that when you are on a bike, you are vulnerable. That is the element of danger one takes into consideration. This was just stright madness altogether, but if you are going to threaten a man who has his family with him, you better be ready to take the consequences. They say a man defending his home is stronger than 10 hired soldiers. Give him a 2 ton SUV and make that 40! I ride, but actions taken by these riders is inexscusable on all kinds of level. You wanna get fed up and throw a finger, then do it. You wanna stop traffic and surround a man and his family...f*&k you...

[SilveradoTX]

It's true, we don't have a video leading up to this, and the video conveniently cuts off when they break the windows. That said, as a person who commutes daily and has ridden with mature, responsible riders... based on the video I find the bikes at fault, not all of them, but many of them.

A group ride should be an ordered thing, not a meandering chaotic ameba.

We see the one bike riding in the Range Rovers lane next to the drivers door, he then accelerates in front and looks back as he gets on his brakes (this is why I don't see it as just an accident).

We can't see what happens next, but with the driver having his wife and five year old in the vehicle with him I cannot blame him for getting the heck out of Dodge.

Next, when the vehice is stopped again around the 5:00 mark, one person starts to black the vehicle while another runs up and grabs the door handle... Again, I can't blame the driver for getting out of there.

And lastly, while stopped in traffic, to break the windows and harm a person in front of his wife and child... Now you have two, potentially three, people who are mentally and emotionally scarred and will probably never associate anything good with motorcycles.

The motorcycle community has been trying to shake the biker gang image for decades and events like this do nothing to help the rest of us who follow the rules of the road and obey the laws, and we are instantly associated with this type of foolishness.

[snrusnak]

The motorcycle community has been trying to shake the biker gang image for decades and events like this do nothing to help the rest of us who follow the rules of the road and obey the laws, and we are instantly associated with this type of foolishness.

[up]

[PaulPud]

I was suppose to be there. I know a lot if them. Going to find out whole story after work. From what I understand he was getting on parkway and didn't want to wait for 5000 bikes and just ran them off road.

[PaulPud]

And yes one biker did get killed at :50 second mark.

[rah7777777]

Looks like a bunch of D-bag motorcycle riders to me.....


Not saying the cager didn't make em made before the video started, but I've never seen that large of a group (un-escorted) not be a bunch of d-bags. Just saying.

Don't know what led up to that ,
but what would you do if I bunch of bikers boxed you in and obviously we're not happy with you?
Tough to say....

But I try my best to not get in that situation.

[BuddhaBuell]

I was initially pissed off at what I saw but after reexamining the situation I agree with the sane perspective that most of you have pointed out.

Other then observing that the mob mentality spread like wild fire thru the group (same thing happens regardless of demographic), it is truly something to behold from a distance and after the fact and the other thing that stood out were the amount of SQUIDS cruising in that mass of bikers,

the dude on the Gix-a-ma-call-it-a-saki with his hunny on the back rockin the high cut bootie shorts,
(bitch be lookin fine wif all dat scar tishue)
[smirk]

[konarider94]

i just wish in place of the range rover was a lifted truck on 37's or bigger. that would have been pretty interesting and entertaining to watch.

[Loki]

At least they didn't kill him.Â* BS they didn't get arrested.
I agree 100% on this, everyone needs to be arrested. And yes I think if the driver is arrested that he doesnt go to jail for defending himself. But Im still pretty sure I wouldve beat his ass for running over my friends (if they were). Again I dont fault him for getting out of there but they way he did get out of there was not the best way, how did he think that would end? Did he think 50+ riders were just going to be like "Lets not **** with that guy, hes crazy", or did he think that he would be able to get away from said motorcycles in his o so stealthy and nimble land rover?

I think it just comes down to the fact that the driver refused to yield to the riders and started driving aggressively, thus pissing the riders off. There are other vehicles in the video before the landrover, and you dont see the riders ****ing with them. I dont think the riders just up and see a land rover and said "**** that guy, lets mess with him." Though I could be wrong. What I do know is-
RaY9k6tuLog

[jstfkndi]

So he didn't want to wait. So he may have drove like an asshole. Is the best scenario getting in front of him with your bike and brake checking him? So if he avoided hitting the one douche in front of him and the other twelve behind slammed into his tailgate...is he still at fault? Point being, just because you ride a motorcycle and ride in a large group doesn not give you total permission to own the road. I can't see what is happening in the video up into the point that he guns it. Wouldn't be a fair assesment to say that he was in the right, so I have to take a step back. But...I also can't see if they are trying to get into his car, are beating on it trying to break glass and get in. There is a lot of fail in this video. Mostly from the bikers if you ask me. Up until he ran people over (which I hope he or his wife would have been on the phone with cops as well, not just the bikers) it was still a group of "bad-asses" (I absolutely use that term loosley) who are harassing a driver and his family. RIP to the rider who was killed if that is the case. Perhaps this person's death won't be in vain and can teach others to say your piece and move on rather than escalate a situation. Somehow I doubt it though....

[Fatty SS]

Nobody was killed. Police reports indicate the driver was the only person to sustain injury. He was dragged out if his SUV and beaten and slashed in his face and chest.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/pack-motorcyclists-chase-man-suv-attack-upper-manhattan-street-fender-bender-west-side-highway-article-1.1471585

[wolfo68]

To be fair the news doesn't always get it right. I'll say here what I said on my fb post.

"People were acting like idiots all the way around in that vid."

"If the guy really turned the camera on at that point I would think something else happened to make the guy try to stop the car. Since the guy that got bumped clearly looked back at the car a few times before braking that's what it seems to me.

Either way.

Long story short, don't ride like idiots. Those big vehicles can take you out easily."


We know they're impatient, and we know they don't look for us even if we're obvious.

[s0dhi]

As infuriating as cagers can be, I don't think the actions of the bikers were warranted. There was a real mob mentality to the bikers' actions and it appears they did eventually pull the driver out of the Range Rover and beat and cut him up. To what end was all of this chaos beneficial? Bikes get damaged, bikers get hurt and the driver is assaulted.

That group isn't the type of biker I want to ride with or be associated with.

[clarson_75]

The motorcyclists were trying to block the road so they could have a stunt session. A traffic accident occured when one of the bikers cut off the Rover and brake checked him. Then a bunch of bikers started to f*ck with the driver. I would have run them over too! Play stupid games, win stupid prizes! I just wouldn't have stopped until there were police present. The driver of the RR is going to be happy someone was stupid enough to put that video on the net.

[J_Undisputed]

These spontaneous rides pop up all the the time in NYC. No offense to anyone in or associated with these people. Some people just want to ride in the company of other riders. Others are just squids that like protection for their stupidity by riding in numbers. Some of them mess with cagers because they feel they have the advantage. Like that one idiot that pulls in front of the Range Rover, cuts throttle and brake checks him. Stupid move to begin with picking fights you cant win.

Can't say for sure what happens before this video starts but from what i've witnessed, it usually goes like this. A whole stream of bikes get together for a ride. They don't ride in formation, many times there's no road captain, or sweepers. Sometimes they have a chase vehicle or two (sometimes up front filming). The try to fill as much of the roadway as possible with a few of them stunting and mugging for cameras etc. You get some uptight person who phones the cops and reports them or starts screaming out there window about how they're irresponsible and should be locked up. The bikers surround the car and deliberately mess with them. Kick at the car, bend the mirrors etc, scratch up the paint and then speed off confident the and their bikes are too confident to be caught. The drivers usually back down as driving a shiny new range rover, bmw, mercedes probably already has their insurance higher than they like. but beware of that guy in the old truck who's also has a new york attitude.

Looks like the brake check idiot gets tapped and dismounted and starts whining and playing tough guy. The driver pulls over one lane. The dismounted rider and other squids surround the car. They trying to get the door open and Surprise!!! their intimidation tactics worked... TOO WELL....the driver tries to get him and his family out of there. He plows through the bikes barricading his car. (Gotta love that 4 wheel drive.) The squiddies give chase with the responsible riders are probably back down the road on the phone with police or decided its probably more trouble/ attention/ excitement than they wanted and broke off from the group. If you google Hollywood rides nyc, halloween rides nyc .. you'll see a whole bunch of vids like this of people just getting off on stopping traffic and hogging some of the biggest busiest streets in nyc. Some are just kids just wanting to have fun and really having no idea what kind of mortal danger they're in. Others are responsible riders that just like the sound of 100 bikes together.. and still others are selfish attention whores and fake tough guys on cheap bikes with no insurance and a brass pair.

I found myself in the middle of these once, rolled down the window, hung two fingers out and kept going without incident. Not sure if the AMA window decal had anything to do with it. I've also seen a group of stunters run from cops while the rest of their group stopped and were detained for an hour and grilled for info about the ones that ran. I've had cabs try to cut me off when i was riding and people cut across painted barriers on the highway and run me into the weeds just short of a rail. There's different types of riders and different types of cagers. when the worse of the two meet the potential for stupidity increases exponentially.

[snrusnak]

That video makes a good advertisement for range rover. I don't think my 2wd truck would have gone over those bikes...

[ANIMOSITY]

Seen this on another site. Says that the Range Rover called 911 to report the bikers just the incident occurred. And All I can say, had that been me in the truck, the first ASSHAT that tried to open my door, with my family inside, would have two BAY windows in his chest.. Idiots like these make anyone on a bike look bad.

By Tracy Connor, NBC News

New York City police are hunting for a vengeful band of up to 30 motorcyclists who forced a driver on a harrowing high-speed chase through upper Manhattan and then beat him in front of his wife and two-year-old daughter.

The six-minute pursuit on Sunday — which was captured on video and posted on YouTube — began when the driver of a black Range Rover called 911 to report erratic bikers taking part in an unauthorized rally dubbed Hollywood Stuntz, police told NBC New York.

The video shows the motorcycles converged on the 33-year-old man's vehicle on the West Side Highway in Harlem, and he apparently clipped a bike that cut closely in front of him.

The motorcycle rider suffered a broken leg, Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said. Some of the other bikers then surrounded the SUV.

"They take their helmets and start to dent his car and apparently his tires are slashed there with a knife," Kelly said.

The video, shot with a helmet mounted cameras, shows the driver then took off, knocking down more bikes as others tore down the blacktop after him.

During a 50-block chase, the bikers managed to trap the Range Rover again and one of them got off and pulled open the driver's side door before the motorist swerved and sped away.

After his tires finally went flat on a side street, the group blocked him in again. One biker was seen yanking off his helmet and using it to smash in the SUV window.

Police said the man suffered black eyes and other injuries in the subsequent beating. After receiving some stitches, he was released from Columbia University Medical Center.

No arrests have been made, but police are examining surveillance video from a nearby gas station where some of the motorcyclists stopped.

Kelly said the bikers did not have a permit for the rally and the NYPD only learned of the show-boating event — in its second year through social media.

He said police had fanned out around Manhattan to watch for trouble, arresting 15 bikers and confiscating 55 motorcycles unrelated to the attack on the Range Rover.

[Loki]

That video makes a good advertisement for range rover.Â* I don't think my 2wd truck would have gone over those bikes...

And how well their windows hold up! Look, they never shattered the window.

[JohnnyD]

The person that took the original video has more videos posted on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Michelinman900?feature=watch

He had more posted this morning from the time frame in question, but it seems he deleted/removed them.

[Dave A]

Those morons got off easy.

[SEXT9]

I was looking at the choices in vehicles in his other videos. ATV's really? The news was reporting LA having the same problems there. It looks like biker gangs have a new choice in transportation since Harley's are prohibitively expensive. It makes me wonder how many other cities have this problem. And how far are they going to branch out?

[turbohearse]

Looking at the video the land rover tried to stop and the idiot what break checked him is not that smart of a rider. But on other hand without a video what the driver done what was so bad to piss off a whole bunch of bikers there isn't to much to discuss he probably feared of his family's life is on the line and he was trying to protect himself i would of stayed there and called the cops "911" before he decided to take out a whole bunch of people. he would be safe locked up in his car if he just stopped and waited for police. There not many 1%er sport bikers maybe 1 out of a million of them lol "I know one" if they both obeyed the law this wouldn't of happen its both there faults.if it was a real ride with a bunch of bikes they would of just picked one lane not take the whole entire freaking street!

[anrkizm95]

theres no way to tell what happened or what started it.but going by the video looks like the biker got what he deserved.people like that dont have the guts for a one on one if that was me with my wife and kids i would have done the same or shot his dumb ass.there was no way if the driver had gotten out that a fight wouldnt have started and if he beat the first guy fair he still more to go.those are the asshats that give us a bad name.

[mowgoli84]

I think the land rover at the beginning did something ignorant and pissed a rider off, then got scared and ran everyone over. Needless to say my hands are shaking after watching that from anger. I wanted to see that driver pounded. Wish we say him get pulled out and beat (not to death). **** with my friends and I will lose it is my mind set while riding.

Now dont get me wrong I dont blame him for being scared and running off. But I want to know what he did at the beginning to piss the riders off enough to pull him over, the ride did not look to be an aggressive nor stunty ride. As a rider If someone does something ignorant to me when riding and it was an accident on their part, a simple wave of the hand with a look of apology calms me down. Im guessing this was a driver who refused to back down to a bunch of "bikers."

Loki, you likely don't give a ****, but I must say I am a little disgusted with you're response. We've both been around this forum for quite some time...

Pulled out and beat? Seriously? Now, like many have said we can't see what the driver of the Rover initially did... however, its his RIGHT to be on the roadway too! From what I have read, local enforcement has been trying to get this ride shut down for quite some time because of the riding habits of many of the participants. Stunting, speeding, wheelies, total disregard for other pedestrians; people riding fourwheelers and dirtbikes. I've experienced being immersed while in a car by groups like this multiple times and as a fellow motorcycle rider it pisses me off; the total disregard of other people and traffic laws needs to be dealt with.
So yeah, maybe he did something to piss the bikers off, but at the point the video begins the driver of the Rover has broken ZERO laws. Then he's caged in, a rider cuts him off by inches and slams on the brakes? What do you expect?

Did you not read the article? He was with his wife and 2 year old daughter ( which you have made it clear that you'd like them to witness him being brutaly beaten). I can tell you first hand, if anyone, I mean anyone threatened myself, my family, and especially my child I would have ran those hard ass wanna be's over faster than he did, and if I weren't able to get away, and they gained access to the vehicle you better believe 5 or 6 of them would've been on the table at the coroner's with slugs in their heads. It's unfortunate that he ran over a few people, but I don't think any logical human being would expect him to sit there as 50+ "thug wanna be's" rip his car apart before handing him and possibly his family an ass kicking. Where he went wrong was NOT driving to the nearest police station, then again maybe he was trying to before he was caged again and beaten.

Would've done the same thing if I had found myself in his situation, only I would've went straight to the nearest police department, and I sure as hell wouldn't have stopped the vehicle until I was there or it was not longer functioning. That being said, I would have pulled over asap to let all those dbags go by, so they could continue their reckless idiot fest.

I love to ride, but these guys like most just give riders a worse reputation. Anyone who sides with the "bikers" needs to grow up and reconsider their values.

My two cent's. No one puts my family in danger, and if they do, they're going to feel some pain.

[wolfo68]

If I saw that many bikers coming up on me I would've gotten over or even off the road.

[anrkizm95]

Loki, you likely don't give a ****, but I must say I am a little disgusted with you're response. We've both been around this forum for quite some time...seems like he would fit in with crowd in the video to be honest

[SEXT9]

Take a look at the other videos for the things that group does: THE LINK (http://www.youtube.com/user/Michelinman900/videos)

[mowgoli84]

Sure.. these guys never do anything that would be looked at as unbecoming or against the law...lmao.

AEKkegknw-Q

[rah7777777]

I didn't realize the guy had his family in the car....

If a group of ricers box me in on the highway with my wife and daughter in the car, you can be damn sure my 5.3L will be playing monster jam!!

It's 2wd, but I don't think it would have any issues...

[mowgoli84]

If a group of ricers box me in on the highway with my wife and daughter in the car, you can be damn sure my 5.3L will be playing monster jam!!

I like you.

[mowgoli84]

Best choice for the driver here would have been to pull over and back off and apoligize whether he was right or wrong.Â* An SUV is a tool of death vs a motorcycle.Â* Running over that biker was worse than the biker caging him in.Â* The driver had to expect retribution.Â* He is very lucky he got way with his life.

So, after a biker cuts him off by literally inches, then slams the brakes, causing incidental contact (it seems), he should have pulled over and apologized as they began assaulting his vehicle in an attempt to gain access to the occupants inside? Pretty sure after the incidental contact, these guys were not going to accept an "apology".

He was in danger, his wife, and 2 year old child were in danger, he had every right to use his "tool of death" to eradicate himself from the situation.. Its a damn shame he didn't squash a few more of those aggressive tool bags while he was at it. If there were a donation program set up for him and his family for his legal counsol I would gladly chip in. The NYPD needs to crack down on these guys, and I am sure they will after such an incident as this.

[GregoXB]

Yes, backing off would have been the best thing here. The bikers didn't kill him after he ran over one of them, they wouldn't have killed him if he backed off. The more aggressive he was, the bigger of an ass whooping he bought himself., and the more danger he placed himself and his family in.

[Macbuell]

I would have done exactly what this driver did until the end. At the end I would have thrown it in reverse and probably ran over a couple more of the riders. If it were not NYC I would have done that while pointing my carry pistol at their heads. Wife and Daughter in the car changes everything.

By myself I probably would have pulled over and gotten out. Have yet to find a fight I was unable to talk my way out of, but if they wanted I would have handed that group of bikers my ass for a beating.

[snrusnak]

These guys are a real class act [down]

I'm with you mowgoli after watching some of their other videos I agree it would have been nice if he knocked a few more of these guys over, especially since he got the beating as a repercussion.

If you honestly believe the best thing would have been to pull over and apolagize you are a moron. If he would have got out of the car with nobody around he probably would be dead. I bet the reason he's alive is because his wife called 911 during the "getaway" and/or people in the city where he got trapped saw and helped.


I would have done exactly what this driver did until the end. At the end I would have thrown it in reverse and probably ran over a couple more of the riders

And I agree with this as well.

[03Firebolt9R]

All I can say is, there would have been as many shot bikers as I had ammo.

[mowgoli84]

Yes, backing off would have been the best thing here.Â* The bikers didn't kill him after he ran over one of them, they wouldn't have killed him if he backed off.Â* The more aggressive he was, the bigger of an ass whooping he bought himself., and the more danger he placed himself and his family in.

Still find it amusing that you think they (the bikers) would've handled it in a mature nature. The didn't kill him after he ran one of them over? No ****, he took off before they could smash in the window and drag him out... at which point anything could have happened... how many times have people gotten beat to DEATH in these situations where there are so many people that people begin to think that they can get away with it simply because of the chaos of the situation. He should have IMMEDIATELY had his wife call authorities and headed straight to the nearest police station when they could have had units sitting in the parking lot waiting for their arrival, and if they didn't he could have driven that thing straight through the front doors. In that situation, whether he was right or wrong, or did something to "piss them off" he had every right to defend his family in any way he could, in this instance he had a 4,000 pound SUV.

Take a look at some of these youtube videos.. I am all about having a good time, but not at the expense of others, and not in residential areas. I sure as hell stay in my lane.

[thrstrmech]

at about the :17 mark, looks like he was taunting the Rover, looking at him several times just before getting in front of him and then slow down to a crawl. what a dumb ass, a few hundred pounds of sport bike vs. several thousand pounds of suv, hmmm, what did he expect was going to happen? regardless, just bad judgement by both involved initially and compounded by others. seems like a very disorganized ride, just everyone doing what they please... [down]

[snrusnak]

grego, it's self defense. It's not trying to be a badass(like the bikers were). Whether you can over take them or not, it's better to try rather than get beaten and/or killed without even putting up a fight.

[03Firebolt9R]

No **** Grego. Come try and break into my house too and see what happens. It won't be movie that's for sure. There is a reason people carry.

[mowgoli84]

If you went into attack mode, you and your familes would be..... D E A D.Â* WHo do you think you guys are, Charles Bronson?Â* DIrty Harry?Â* Lay off the movies.

Attack mode? Didn't say he should go into attack mode... saying he was right to go into " protect myself and my family by all means necessary, and if it means running over thug wanna be dbags so be it" mode.


Unless you have a gun and badge you are NO ONE. You have no power. Even the cops here are scared of thugs. Maybe in Texas, but not in NYC. Here the NYPD runs the streets and their curruption runs DEEP.

They NYPD are scared of thugs...yet somehow still run the streets. smh

You're full of a whole lot of stupid...aren't you? I am starting to wonder if you watched the same video the rest of us have.

[03Firebolt9R]

Unless you have a gun and badge you are NO ONE. You have no power. Even the cops here are scared of thugs. Maybe in Texas, but not in NYC. Here the NYPD runs the streets and their curruption runs DEEP.


[confused] WHO has been watching movies?

[mowgoli84]

WHO has been watching movies?

[up][smirk]

[anrkizm95]

All you guys would have been murdered in broad daylight
no but i would have defended the **** out of myself in broad daylight.


If you went into attack mode, you and your familes would be..... D E A D. WHo do you think you guys are, Charles Bronson? DIrty Harry? Lay off the movies. most of tuff guys fail once the first couple drop.its called self preservation

[03Firebolt9R]

no but i would have defended the **** out of myself in broad daylight.

/\That.

[03Firebolt9R]

I think it's time to move Grego. :)

[mowgoli84]

You think this incident is something new in NYC?Â* You guys are shocked buy this video?Â* Just youtube the dailynews video postings.Â* This **** happens here everyday.Â* Its been happening everyday since I was a kid going to school and getting mugged on the bus.

I for one am not shocked to see this. Sorry you were beaten up as a kid, but trying to defend these bikers is asinine.

[snrusnak]

Just because it's not new doesn't mean it's ok.

[anrkizm95]

You think this incident is something new in NYC? You guys are shocked buy this video? Just youtube the dailynews video postings. This **** happens here everyday. Its been happening everyday since I was a kid going to school and getting mugged on the bus. nyc is no different than any other big city.the same things happen in in dallas,oakland,trenton take your pick theres hundreds of them.

[03Firebolt9R]

Seriously Greg, do you think we are all Canadian?

[snrusnak]

what's your deal man? none of us want to instigate anything or start a fight or put a dent in crime. We are just willing to defend ourselves when attacked.

Looks to me like you're a "tough guy" just like the guys in the video that picked the fight.

[anrkizm95]

Its cool though, all you Charllie Bronsons come on down to NYCbeen there bronx,trenton and camden are some old stomping grounds of mine.they are also **** holes and have no desire to return but not everyone gets intimidated by the streets.

[snrusnak]

LOL @ 03firebolt9R

[anrkizm95]

Looks to me like you're a "tough guy" just like the guys in the video that picked the fight.hes no tuff guy out of the 4 f's i would say he's a freezer or a fleaer i wouldnt go as far as saying he's a ****er but maybe

[s0dhi]

Seriously Greg, do you think we are all Canadian?

LOL @ 03firebolt9R

Huh? What's wrong with us Canadians? [confused]

We don't have guns, but we sure as hell will defend ourselves. :)

[snrusnak]

just a joke s0dhi lol

[03Firebolt9R]

Huh? What's wrong with us Canadians?



Its cool though, all you Charllie Bronsons come on down to NYC, open up a death wish. We could use you guys down here.

Nothin, it's just that I am about 1550 miles south of NYC.

[s0dhi]

just a joke s0dhi lol :D


Sure you can defend yourselves, but it would only be a cool way of suicide.
Based on your attitude, why bother doing anything, ever? Just let anyone do whatever they want to you and your family, I guess. Might is right, and all. :(

[mowgoli84]

Crime won't stop here or around the rest of the country.Â* It only goes through phases.Â* There is no such thing as a utopia and there is nothing any of you can do anything about it.Â* Its like pissing in the ocean.Â*

Sure you can defend yourselves, but it would only be a cool way of suicide.


Seriously? Who are you? You really haven't made a single argument that really truly relates to the events that unfolded in the video that started this thread. You can defend yourself, but it would be a cool was of suicide? What the **** does that mean? This individual in the Rover did defend himself, and unfortunately he wasn't able to get to a safe place before he was assaulted, again. Sound's like you're a bitter little man who needed to stand up for himself on the bus but never had the balls to do so. You must let everyone **** on you constantly with you're "defending yourself is suicide attitude".

Sell you're bike and go buy a Prius.

[GregoXB]

Stand up to 5 guys at knife point, genius, pure genius.

[netty2424]

I think that driver in the rover did the same thing all of us would've done, get the hell out of there at all costs. Live to fight another day. Begging and pleading wouldn't have helped. The bikers were looking for a fight despite which side was in the right or wrong before the video started rolling.

If it were me, I'm on the gas and getting the hell out if there while calling someone for help and legal advice. Way too out numbered to talk his way out of that mess.

[03Firebolt9R]

nyc is no different than any other big city.the same things happen in in dallas,oakland,trenton take your pick theres hundreds of them

This is very true, NYC is the only place this happens. If everyone stood up for themselves in these situations, maybe they wouldn't be as frequent or as brazen.

[rah7777777]

5 guys... I'd still 12 rounds in my pocket.

[03Firebolt9R]

If the guy in the Rover changed just one bikers mind about doing something like this again....mission accomplished.

[mowgoli84]

Stand up to 5 guys at knife point, genius, pure genius.


Wow, sir, you are retarded ( I mean that in the in the most politically correct manner possible) I truly believe you are a low function system. He didn't attempt to stand up to them, he attempted to flee aka protect himself and HIS FAMILY in the most sensible way possible, which happened to be placing his foot on the accelerator. Staying to fight would have likely resulted in murder, in front of his wife and child. Again, its pretty obvious that they were not going to let him "apologize" for rear ending a biker that was at fault for the accident to begin with.

You can't seem to grasp the situations in this video. He didn't stand up to them, or confront them, they surrounded the vehicle at which time they began an assault.

You obviously are bitter about something, and it stems a bit deeper than this video.

[oh9bolt]

Gregoxb do you live down in the hoods of NYC?

[ztied]

If the biker would have kept going in stead of braking in front of the range rover for an ass ****,none of this would have happened.1 guy could have prevented this from happening at all,but he wanted to be a badass in front of his buddies.gotta ride smart.If everyone could just get along

[snrusnak]

Wow man you seriously are retarded.

Come to think of it how have you survived this long?

[BuddhaBuell]

don't be messin' with the New York Squid
they be packed, jackin and smakin' bitches in Rovers since '86

http://kaispace.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/njc.jpg

[rah7777777]

Different folks think in different ways.

Some would want to "talk" it over with the nice biker guys who boxed them in. Maybe laugh it off over some coffee at Starbucks or a banana split from Dairy Queen.

And some would want to keep their wife and daughter away from trouble. It's not the rovers fault a bunch of d-bags parked their bikes in front of his SUV....

For the record I can not stand it when bikers shut down a highway to do stunts... I fully support an 18 wheeler at full speed breaking up these activities...

[ztied]

could the biker have not cut him off,why shouldn`t the biker have made way for the range rover.
I love riding also,but I don`t want to be ass ****ed by a car.
And whoever is in the right it would be stupid to stop with a large group of bikers all around you.Theres always at least one stupid person in the group that don`t think.

[oh9bolt]

Gregoxb, You are a wanabe that has no clue what you are talking about...

I have watched your youtube vids and there is no chance that you could hang with anyone in that group. You would be in the back of the pack trying to be a part of something that made you look like a bad ass. I like how you stand up for a lifestyle you dont live..

Thugged out...

WxozheEre64

[WayneBrettzky]

Start treating us with some respect Grego.. Now apologize.

[squidbuellie]

This was a very interesting video......and made me laugh a few times....
First I thought..... it was Brazil all over again. Then it was "Man he better have a full tank of gas"
then it was he sure is driving cool for a guy who is "maybe" in fear for his family's life?
Then I was like... Looks like something I would see happen in a video from china.
And here is my option....

If I was there I would have beat him.....and if his wife made a noise, I more then likely would have beat her too....the child in the car is unfortunately a victim of a bunch of bad choices made by the father.........lucky enough to only be 5 months old and not being the wiser

Is that wrong.........maybe? But caught in the heat of the moment and how things escalated so fast.........if it was one of my friends that was laying in the middle of the freeway, possibly dying?


Now I have read a lot of the childish comments about putting holes in people and talking tough, but if it was any of you guys, I would hope that you had the sence to either, not put yourself in the situation or man up and wait till the cops got there.

[mtnmason]

I fully support an 18 wheeler at full speed breaking up these activities...


[up] WINNER! :D

[anrkizm95]

Wow man you seriously are retarded.

Come to think of it how have you survived this long?[up][up]
i hope he doesnt have a wife or kids

[mowgoli84]

This thread sure did get lively. [up]

Still, anyone who is siding with the bikers in this instance should go park their bike on the nearest railroad tracks and wait.

[mtnmason]

and if his wife made a noise, I more then likely would have beat her too

[up] CLASSY [cool]

[mowgoli84]

Amen

You must be a man.

You sir, are clearly....not.

[03Firebolt9R]

Really squid. Who's talking tough?


If I was there I would have beat him.....and if his wife made a noise, I more then likely would have beat her too....the child in the car is unfortunately a victim of a bunch of bad choices made by the father.........lucky enough to only be 5 months old and not being the wiser

Is that wrong.........maybe? But caught in the heat of the moment and how things escalated so fast.........if it was one of my friends that was laying in the middle of the freeway, possibly dying?

Real tough guy beating up women. That has the stupidest thing ever posted on a forum....ever.

[03Firebolt9R]

I hope it was In jest and I missed it.

[mowgoli84]

If I was there I would have beat him.....and if his wife made a noise, I more then likely would have beat her too....the child in the car is unfortunately a victim of a bunch of bad choices made by the father.........lucky enough to only be 5 months old and not being the wiser

Is that wrong.........maybe?Â* Â*But caught in the heat of the moment and how things escalated so fast.........if it was one of my friends that was laying in the middle of the freeway, possibly dying?

I wasn't even going to touch this one.

[anrkizm95]

Now I have read a lot of the childish comments


If I was there I would have beat him.....and if his wife made a noise, I more then likely would have beat her too.... no wonder we are once again at the opposite ends of the spectrum.you are without a dout the biggest asswipe fake ass douchebag zozzle ive have ever encountered on the world wide web.jmho

[mowgoli84]

You just did.

Go lay down somewhere.

[oh9bolt]

you are without a dout the biggest asswipe fake ass douchebag zozzle ive have ever encountered on the world wide web.jmho

[up]


real tough guy beating up women. That has the stupidest thing ever posted on a forum....ever.

By a moderator of this forum no less.

[03Firebolt9R]

[up][up]

[mowgoli84]

Internet tough guys, interent tough guys every where!Â* They got guns, they got land rovers and they aren't scared to use them.Â* WATCH OUT!

Your comments make it seem that you think this guy decided to run down these dbags for no reason. He was in danger and in his right to protect himself... how can you not understand that? Oh wait, you're full retard.

[03Firebolt9R]

Done troll.

[oh9bolt]

No prob gangsta.

[anrkizm95]

O BTW, thanks for posting my header install video.
great vid ghetto banger

[mowgoli84]

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/7914_20130930215040_L.jpg

[squidbuellie]

Really squid. Who's talking tough?

I'm not talking tough... I'm more talking about a extreme situation.... And I knew that my comment would get somebody to say something about it.

But one day you will get yourself in a extreme situation, then let me know how rational your thinking.......

[mowgoli84]

But one day you will get yourself in a extreme situation, then let me know how rational your thinking.......

Some people are capable of rational thoughts when under pressure. Suggesting that senselessly beating an innocent man, his wife and a 2 year old child is even a possibility just show's how truly challenged you are.

I feel sorry for you.

[03Firebolt9R]

I'm not talking tough... I'm more talking about a extreme situation.... And I knew that my comment would get somebody to say something about it.

But one day you will get yourself in a extreme situation, then let me know how rational your thinking.......

Been in plenty of them in my 42 years, thanks for the insight.

[squidbuellie]

Suggesting that senselessly beating an innocent man, his wife and a 2 year old child is even a possibility just show's how truly challenged you are.

The internet is great.......let's blow things even way more out of context.

Innocent man........ Went out the window when he ran over the other bikers.......What about the other guys that where ran over? What about their family's? Not the posse that chased him down?

[heagachongoose]

Its cool though, all you Charllie Bronsons come on down to NYC, open up a death wish. We could use you guys down here. Bring your revolvers and clean up this town. I like your atittudes. With 50 or so of you, each of you taking out AT LEAST a 100 a piece, that will put a massive dent into crime

Ill just grab my battle axe and my batman suit and ill be on my way to clean house. ;)


For real though guys. This conversation has escalated to the point of foolishness. In a dire situation protection of your family comes first at all costs. And if that means running over a few dumbasses in front of you to get your family away from an angry mob, then so be it. But at the same time if anybody hurt one of my friends, regardless of it was due to some stupid action on their behalf, they would have me to answer to. BUT NOT LIKE THAT. @That being said, what happened in this video could have been easily prevented through exercise of common sense. Sadly some people are lacking in that department. As obviously displayed in both the video and on this thread.

Contrary to popular belief the world is not a perfect place. I would not be too wrong to say that **** like this happens all the time. Most people tend to take what safeties we do have for granted and forget that fact.

[mowgoli84]

The internet is great.......let's blow things even way more out of context.

Innocent man........ Went out the window when he ran over the other bikers.......What about the other guys that where ran over? What about their family's?Â* Not the posse that chased him down?

At the time this video began, there was/is no evidence that the driver of the Rover broke any laws in any way, so yes, he is an innocent man. Then, a Squid...likely similar to yourself cut him off by inches and the abruptly slowed down in a manner at which incidental contact was made (the biker really being the one that was at fault). The "group" then surrounded his vehicle and began what one could call and assault. It's too bad more of them weren't ran the **** over, they put themselves in a position where they forced a person to take whatever means possible to protect himself. Something called SELF DEFENSE. Heard of it?

Maybe these biker boys you're defending should think about their "family" when they are out riding like full blown retards. If you think their behavior was warranted, you're obviously one of them, and I'd love to see you try to do the same to me and my family in a similar situation.

[BuddhaBuell]

http://media.egotvonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/ROAD-RAGE-GUY-1.jpg?41ed4f

[sprk_sprd]

All you tough guys who are saying you would have went rouge with your SUV or gun are sad excusses for humans.

I would've gone rogue in my Prius. Get 55mpg + squish some squid = a good day!

[Theycallmecrash]

What.... The..... ****....

So, yeah not gonna touch this... I just see a few of you in a different light.

[squidbuellie]

Really......


At the time this video began, there was/is no evidence that the driver of the Rover broke any laws in any way, so yes, he is an innocent man. Then, a Squid...likely similar to yourself cut him off by inches and the abruptly slowed down in a manner at which incidental contact was made (the biker really being the one that was at fault). The "group" then surrounded his vehicle and began what one could call and assault. It's too bad more of them weren't ran the **** over, they put themselves in a position where they forced a person to take whatever means possible to protect himself. Something called SELF DEFENSE. Heard of it?

Maybe these biker boys you're defending should think about their "family" when they are out riding like full blown retards. If you think their behavior was warranted, you're obviously one of them, and I'd love to see you try to do the same to me and my family in a similar situation.


Go back to making goggles and pabst exhausts.........

[sprk_sprd]

You wouldn't have done ****. You've been playing too much GTA.

Junior, you've become the laughing stock of this forum. For your own sake, please stop posting.

[sprk_sprd]

Would your opinion change if i told you my Prius has "No Fear" stickers all over it?

[ztied]

My opinion is the retarded badass bikers forced the guy to run over more of the other bikers.the bad thing is the bikers were too stupid to relize it was their fault,in the first place.
bikers dont own the highway.

[s0dhi]

The driver of the Land Rover was the first to attempt murder.

I'll get your jail cell ready for your extended stay once you are found guilty of vehicular manslaughter.
So which is it? Murder or manslaughter? Is it fair to say that the SUV driver was under duress? You make it sound like he left the house saying, "Honey, grab the little one, and lets go out today and run over some bikers." I am doubtful that running over the bikers was premeditated.


Depending on what judge presides over this case, this can end bad for both parties.
I'm not sure about this. The consensus here and in other places on the net, is that the driver was justified in his actions. Clearly he was caught in the criminal activities of the riders and they turned on him. If one were to look at the character of the parties involved coupled with the videos, it's fairly easy to come to the conclusion that the bikers were, in several cases, the instigators.

This is clearly visible in this video and the other in which one of their group attempts to assault a prius driver. I wonder how many bikers the prius driver intentionally knocked or ran over?

There is a lot of debate about manhood in terms of stepping out to take a beating, shooting the bikers, fleeing. Those with a family (spouse/kids) have a much different perspective than those that don't (and may be a great deal younger).

Frankly, the general population already puts up with way too much crap from people that act like entitled, selfish jackasses. So, I don't have much sympathy for a group of law-breaking bikers that create an incident then swarm the SUV threatening the occupants, all because they couldn't shutdown a public highway to do their cool big-boy bmx tricks.

[snrusnak]

Some of you can't even read. The report clearly states that the ONLY person injured in this whole event was the driver of the suv. And not only did they drag him out of his car and beat him, they gave him lacerations. Also, it clearly states that when the bikers boxed in the suv on the highway and stopped him they were damaging his vehicle and trying to get in the door. If you are stupid enough to step out of the vehicle at that point then I feel very bad for your family that you are leaving behind in the car helpless.

You act like the suv ran down some bikers for no reason. The bikers engaged the suv, not the other way around.

Though I know using logic will not work, I should just shut up and let you be stupid.

[oh9bolt]

Though I know using logic will not work, I should just shut up and let you be stupid

[up]

^ Lol I run my own company I posted that in the morning like I am doing now, before work. I dont get to stay at home all day and make vids in my parents garage and post non sense all day on a forum like you have been doing.

It wasnt a troll thread it was a event that happened and involved something we all have in common, Motorcycles.

[snrusnak]

damn oh9 you're aging quick! What happened to your hair!

[jstfkndi]

I am starting to wonder and I feel I have a good bead on those that do have children and those that don't. You guys are asking that cooler heads prevail, but wouldn't that have to come from both sides? I am not in the mentallity that mob rules. If you are scared, get the hell out of dodge as quickly as possible! If the bikers had not boxed him in, he could have done just that. I find it funny that you ask him to pull over and take his beating like a man just for having been on the road at the wrong place and wrong time. So if someone runs into the back of your car, are you supposed to just make them get out and take their beating? You have said that you are not a threat to us or are family. Thanks for that, but if your reaction were to be like those bikers, I would have to disagree with you...

[mowgoli84]

Frankly, the general population already puts up with way too much crap from people that act like entitled, selfish jackasses. So, I don't have much sympathy for a group of law-breaking bikers that create an incident then swarm the SUV threatening the occupants, all because they couldn't shutdown a public highway to do their cool big-boy bmx tricks.

This^^

Luckily the bikers provided some great video to help clear the driver. There's plenty more video on youtube to help prove his case that they are a bunch of law ignoring ****s.



Go back to making goggles and pabst exhausts.........

Ew, now you're creeping on me.



http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/7914_20131001070701_L.jpg

[ali]

http://i.imgur.com/t7WmUCZ.jpg

[BuellsRuell]

Wow.

After reading this thread, this is the first time I've ever been embarrassed to be a "Bueller".

Defending these ****ing terrorist ANIMALS??

Encouraging the beating of an innocent woman because her scared husband attempted to flee for his family's safety??

I always thought we were "different in every sense". :(

PS:

GregoXB and squidbuellie:

Please do us a favor: Sell your Buells...TODAY.

Buy a stretched "'Busa" and a sweet plastichrome half-helmet with a point on the top.

Don't ever buy a Buell again, and don't ever post on this forum again.

Sincerely-
99% of us here

[BuddhaBuell]

this pretty much sums it up for all the empty cans making A LOT of noise in this thread



http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_kUSCQBGNZmw/TGEjl38wOcI/AAAAAAAAAAg/ff6F0by2zGw/s640/KeyboardWarriorsGC.jpg


hey GregoXB
does your Buell go 160 mph too?
you should go read that thread to see where your headed...

[smirk]

[jstfkndi]

Hahahaha! Ali. Nice!!

[BuddhaBuell]

I too am confused Mow
good guys wear white hats right?
and the bad guys wear black hats...right?

so what are those two doing up there, they are on opposite sides [confused]
all this homersexual stuff on a good ol fashioned pitch fork and torch burnin session.

Man o man, these interwebs kill me
you people are too ****ing funny at times.


http://blog.nus.edu.sg/iseet/files/2010/09/Internet-Warrior1.jpg



"man, your straight outa a comic book"

[mowgoli84]

Sorry buddah :)

I quit this thread LOL

This guy will get of in self defense.. and rightfully so!

[snrusnak]

lol @ ali

he wasn't even arrested(because he didn't do anything wrong) so there's nothing to get off from.

There are countless things the bikers can and likely will get arrested for. One is pursuing the fleeing vehicle. Just because you have a gang doesn't make you a police officer. Not to mention the endless traffic laws they broke. Oh and beating a man half to death.

[d_adams]

And this is just one more reason I carry. Now, I'm thinking 5 magazines for my .40 isn't enough, I need more for my family outings. I guess I'll have to start toting my AR along as well, but it's kinda hard to conceal it.

I can see the suv driver's perspective, got a small child and wife in the vehicle, I'd be more concerned for their safety than anything else. It's just like the asshats at the roc ride, they "own" the road.

Yep, I'd have shot first and asked the wife for another magazine as required. Crap like those morons did makes me EMBARRASED to be a biker or even associated with motorcycles in general. Don't get me wrong, I love to ride, but the pack mentality has got to go.

Seriously, doing a brake check 2 feet in front of a 5000 lb vehicle, how f*cking stupid do you have to be? Move over, let the guy in the suv go on his way.

[ali]

Here is an updated info about this
http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/national_world&id=9268647

"NEW YORK -- A man driving with his family along a New York City highway was attacked by a group of motorcyclists who chased his SUV for more than 50 blocks after it bumped into one of the bikes, which had stopped suddenly, police said.

The assault on the 33-year-old man began around 1:30 p.m. Sunday on the West Side Highway after he got into an accident with one of the bikers around 125th Street. After the driver and motorcyclist pulled over, they were quickly surrounded by 20 to 30 bikers who began damaging the victim's Range Rover, police said.

The driver, who was traveling with his wife and toddler, struck two other bikers while fleeing, police said. The other bikers gave chase, pursuing him for about 2 1/2 miles, and again surrounded the vehicle. They pulled the man from the SUV and beat him, police said.

The man was taken to a hospital where he required stitches to his face. His wife and child were not injured. The man was not charged.

On Tuesday, police arrested the biker who was involved in the initial accident. Christopher Cruz, 28, was charged with reckless endangerment, reckless driving, endangering the welfare of a child and menacing. He was not injured in the accident.

Police said another biker suffered two broken legs after the SUV ran over him. A second biker suffered a leg injury.

Police believe some of the bikers belong to a gang known as Hollywood Stuntz. They said the motorcyclists were part of a planned but unauthorized event in which hundreds of riders gathered outside of Manhattan, with the intent of driving into Times Square en masse.

[ali]

Really someone made this
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-For-Jay-Meezee/411664345601619

[snrusnak]

And there's the whole story that most of us were able to see.

It also appears bikers did get injured contrary to the initial report. Maybe that is a good lesson for all those idiots that were riding in that gang. But like I said before, logic doesn't work for stupid people, so probably not...

[SEXT9]

It's really sad there wasn't enough decent bikers in that group to be able to restrain their fellow members from doing harm to that family. In the large group rides I've been on over the years, it seems there are reasonable people with a level head to help diffuse a tense situation. Perhaps if there was enough of those people in that group which made themselves visible when traffic got stopped the first time, the outcome would've been much different.

It's also really sad to see the Buell group attack each other because we have different opinions on how we might have handled ourselves in that situation. Being different is the primary reason I purchased a Buell. Sharing ideas is the reason I post on a forum. Respect for one another is the reason I chose this forum over any other. I really hope the way its been going on this thread isn't an indication of how some future responses will be.

[ali]

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1383145_10100847445544294_518033340_n.jpg

[ali]

more videos of the squid group
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3cd_1380579664

[MustangGuy]

Tragic and wrong from all points of view. Classic road rage on both sides. Both riders and drivers need to think more about what they are doing on the road. I've done things both in my car and on my bike that I later think "WTF did I do that for?" I think I've learned from those experiences... hopefully. I don't see anyone in this video who is completely innocent. I ride my Ninja and my Firebolt regularly and I've always had high horsepower Mustangs but these days, I will always back down when pushed. There are too many F*cking whacko's out there. It is not worth it. You can't teach people a lesson on the road and you can't get even.... maybe that's what we should be getting from this. It's good to have an opinion about what happened. Maybe remembering this might keep us out of a situation like this. Let's respect each other's right to have their opinion regardless of whether we think they are right or wrong. This is something we should learn from; it shouldn't be something that divides us.

[ztied]

Thats a good reason for people be allowed to have 30 round magizines,jackass bikers travel in groups larger then 20

[heagachongoose]

LOL @ ali

[Tbone]

I do not know what happened or who is at fault. Just wanted to make some comments and give some opinions:
I think If you hit someone accidentally, in any circumstance, your obligated to stop and render aid. If you hit someone intentionally with your vehicle, especially someone on a motorcycle, bicycle, or walking, I believe that is like attempted murder with a deadly weapon. I am not a lawyer or a paid spokes person so there is no legal validity to what I say.
My opinion: If someone is being an idiot in the road, it does not mean it is okay to intentionaly run them over. My experience says that eventually a genuine idiot will eventually cause an accident that could potentially risk or lose lives as consequence of their decisions. If I was ever being an idiot.... usually life kicked my a55 and I'm glad I survived. If you accidentally hit an idiot, it does not justify intentionally running over more people even if they are idiots also. I believe in what goes around comes around. A Dad who accidentaly or intentionally hits someone riding a motorcycle for whatever reason, then intentionally runs over more people with their family in the car watching them, just might also be an idiot. I am just saying, If the reason he intentionally ran over people was to protect his family, why was he the only one who got his a55 beat? Just saying how do you know his old lady was not kicking his a55 from the front passenger seat and saying I cannot believe your such an idiot. Like Tiger Wood's ex-wife giving a club swinging lesson, my old lady would not tolerate it and expect me to be the better man in the situation or ensure I suffer the reprecussions for my idiocrosy.

[go cytocis]

Well, I'm not going to poke at this hornet's nest, but I am surprised by how quickly public opinion seems to have turned this incident into an issue of race, class, gender and gun rights; everything EXCEPT the simple breach of traffic laws by all parties.

It's also interesting to note the different spin that different media is putting on this. Some headlines read something like "Pack of crazed bikers terrorize and beat family", while others are more like "SUV driver mows over motorcyclists".

[Fatty SS]

Ah, Tbone. Such a well thought out rant... Based on the wrong facts.

Fact: bike brake checked SUV.
Fact: SUV rear ended bike.
Fact: SUV stopped immediately.
Fact: SUV was *immediately* pummeled with helmets and fists, and tires were slashed.
Fact: a rider attempted to open the suv's driver door in an attempt to forcibly remove the driver from the SUV.

AFTER ALL THAT, the SUV driver took off and ran over the bikes that had intentionally caged him in. Most legal professionals would classify him fleeing the scene as a clear case of self defense, which is a far cry from attempted murder.

[BuddhaBuell]

No matter what happens now legally, it comforts me that both parties got their servings of street justice.

up til this point I had no opinion of you as I do not know you but based upon your posts then this doozie...

you are indeed a complete ****ing moron and am glad you are not anywhere near myself or I anyone I care for, you are a danger to yourself and everyone around you.
good luck in life with your attitude good sir.

Dialectic ended so there is no need to reply.

:)

[snrusnak]

Well, I'm not going to poke at this hornet's nest, but I am surprised by how quickly public opinion seems to have turned this incident into an issue of race, class, gender and gun rights; everything EXCEPT the simple breach of traffic laws by all parties.

I don't recall anyone turning this into race, class, gender, gun rights, etc. I do see some mention about guns but didn't hear any real political talk.

[snrusnak]

So you're saying there's no circumstance that it's acceptable to plow over the bikers? What if they are firing assault rifles at you? You'd probably still get out and lock the door, tell your family to wait patiently, and try to reason with the bikers. Or so you say.

And all of us that are arguing this point would likely never be in this situation because we don't ride like assholes and surround cars taking up entire highways, brake check suv's, do stunts down the road, etc. And I bet we (I can only speak for myself) would all flee on our bikes if a vehicle was attempting to run us over. Not CHASE the vehicle.

[SEXT9]

Here's a question then I'm curious about after reading some the posts here. Apparently here's another video (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3cd_1380579664)taken of the same group that day. What should happen when get they hit for driving down the wrong side of the street or running a red light?

From that gang's point of view their rider will have the right of way. So if anyone hits them by mistake with their car they will be in the wrong, right? And thus subject to an ass beating?

[go cytocis]

I don't recall anyone turning this into race, class, gender, gun rights, etc. I do see some mention about guns but didn't hear any real political talk. I wasn't referring to folks on THIS forum specifically, but having said that, there’s some pretty idiotic stuff being said here too.

[lotusexcelle]

So let me be clear on this: Everything that occurred in that video was 100% the fault of the motorcyclists. There is no standpoint from which it can be said the the driver of the car was at *fault* for anything that happened. As a motorcycle rider I take exception to any statement, idea, or thought that would place blame on the SUV driver or his actions. He was hit *intentionally* by a motorcycle, not the other way around. When confronted with a group of people that were demonstrably going to injure him - he fled. That is not a "hit and run" nor is it attempted murder, assault, or a moving violation. I commend him for running over the motorcyclists in his way and would recommend others do the very same in a similar situation.

Anyone stating that the SUV driver was in any way to blame, or that calls for his blood for running over people, is doing a MAJOR disservice to the average, safe, sane motorcyclist. These riders are militant law-breakers. They are guilty of assault and countless moving violations at the VERY least. In the motorcycling community these people should be shunned, admonished, avoided, and possibly jailed. Their collective actions were that of a mob bent on causing endangerment to the public.
Several comments also state that the SUV driver "should have pulled over to let them by". I can't even begin to explain how wrong that is. The road is a shared public place. It is not "owned" by anyone, much less a group of thugs with little to no sense. At that the driver had little time to respond to the situation and was boxed in - he could not have moved over without swiping other bikers. The solution? A biker pulls dangerously close and slows down (and yes, hits the brakes) - causing a collision. Intentional, yes. ANY motorcycle rider that intentionally hits a car is not to be defended. That is the action of someone that is dangerous to himself and others.

Pull over and let them by? Why? This is not an old west movie where laws are made by roving bands of assholes. The crimes committed were done so solely by people on motorcycles. Get those people off the streets by any means necessary. If it means running them over - so be it. I say that as someone that owns a bike. You are in fear for your life, surrounded by a large number of people that *quite plainly* don't care about laws or their own safety. What would you do?

[ali]

Heres some good info about this now
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/cops-hunt-bikers-wanted-wild-upper-manhattan-attack-article-1.1472419

[ali]

http://nypost.com/2013/10/01/cops-bust-bike-thug/

[lotusexcelle]

No - the "why" is because a group of thugs thought it would be fun to beat up a guy for operating a vehicle on the road. The fact that it was car vs bike is completely meaningless. It was one guy vs group of bullies. He fled, and rightly so. On of the guys got hurt? So? The difference is that the bikers were INTENDING to hurt the SUV driver. The SUV driver was only trying to get away.

Grego - if you don't understand the difference then may we never cross paths. The thought of you operating heavy machinery is frightening.

[s0dhi]

Interesting photos from the scene...

http://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/suvbikers-insert-2.jpg

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1472412.1380629149!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/lien-1.jpg

[djs2k2]

Wow, this is crazy I saw this post when there was no comments and didnt want to reply because I couldnt watch the video and knew nothing of the incident. Well I wasnt there and still dont know what happend other than what I saw on youtube and the news. So with that being said I am going to refrain from commenting on who was right and who was wrong. If I knew the whole story and the driver truely was at fault and truely did try to kill some of my biker brothers then I would say that guy gets whats coming, until I realized there was a child there at which point things would totally change the would have only been restrained. Some of you may say you dont know that you would react that way because you were not there, well actually a guy did almost hit me and I chased him down used my bike "not smart" to force him to pull over jumped off my bike "not smart" ran to his suv took my helmet off to use as a weapon "not smart" started cursing him out saw a wife and daughter when he cracked the window appoligizing at which point I listend and then rode away. Now if this situation went the other way and it was all the bikers fault and people were out for blood this was wrong as well. So please no one attack me on this post because I am not justifing any sides actions. Ride a Buell and have a good time.

[rchuff]

The whole thing on the bikers half got way out of hand. The guy in the suv was SCARED for his self and family. The bottom line is NO ONE IS A WINNER HERE !

[theMelvster6]

The sad thing is...I could have sworn I saw a BUELL amongst all chaos...SAD DAY [sad]

[sprk_sprd]

I was home today, looking at my beloved XB12s, thinking about how I've enjoyed the many trips I've taken and admiring all the work I've done on the bike. And I particularly spent time reminiscing how most of my trips over the past two decades have been with only a few really good friends with whom I've ridden tens of thousands of miles. And as a gentle smile formed on my face, and tears collected under my eyes, I remembered all the stupid crap GregoXB has been spewing. So I got into my Prius, revved the engine (it's a hybrid, so it doesn't really rev), put it into Drive and then ran right into my XB12s. I then put it in Reverse and proceeded to run over the XB12s again. And again and again. Then I set the whole wreck on fire.

/end comic relief

[go cytocis]

It was one guy vs group of bullies.Â* He fled, and rightly so.Â* On of the guys got hurt?Â* So?Â* The difference is that the bikers were INTENDING to hurt the SUV driver.Â* The SUV driver was only trying to get away.
I'd suggest it's important to avoid the temptation of painting all "the bikers" with the same brush.

I prefer to ride alone (on pavement at least) but I have participated in large group rides before where I couldn't even tell you the name of the rider next to me let alone be accountable for his/her actions.

The rider who got run over & paralyzed was in the midst of performing his legal duty to remain at the scene & render assistance to the rider who was hit when he brake-checked the SUV. Let's leave the stereo-typing of riders to the cagers.

[bwylie_99]

Ali that was funny!
As to this issue...the whole thing is bad. The bikers initially caused this and the driver panicked. What happened after is open for debate. I believe those bikers have made all of us look bad and I don't condone any of their actions.
Here is my dilemma:
If I watched one of my own get run over I honestly think I would have reacted in a similar very violent fashion. I again don't condone this....but it's easy for everyone to second guess and judge without adrenaline pumping. Right wrong or in different one of those bikers is in a coma right now.

[anrkizm95]

yea saw that also saw the video of his mother crying.better him than the guy with the kid.if your going to hang with a bunch of thugs be prepared to pay the price.i gotta friend that road raged on a guy in 85 he only hit him once the guy died and he got 35 years all because the guy turned in front of him.

[lotusexcelle]

Again - the bikers (and yes I paint the entire group with the INTENT TO DO HARM brush) wanted to do harm. The SUV driver merely wanted to flee. The driver didn't attack anyone. Someone was hurt, yes. But that was due to the ENTIRE GROUP OF RIDERS - yes every last one of them - being involved in illegal activities. Is there something you aren't comprehending about this?

[anrkizm95]

But the fact remains. The bikers only attacked the male operator of the vehicle. The child and the mother were left unharmed.

no father or husband worth a **** would take that chance.there are plenty of times where the whole family is assulted or worse killed if you dont get that theres really no helping you and i feel for your wife and kids.

[snrusnak]

and another motorcyclist turned himself in Tuesday.

This really says it all - even one of the bikers knows what they did was wrong. At least one of them has some sense and a conscious and did the right thing.


He's never going to walk again.

Good, he will be off the streets therefore not causing trouble

Yeah grego we can post pics of the bloody beat up guy too, the difference is he didn't do anything but try to escape.

There's a reason he wasn't arrested, the bikers were, and they are searching for more of the bikers to arrest.

If you still believe the biker's are not at fault after more and more facts come up proving that they are, then you are just being stubborn because you don't want to admit you were wrong.

Yeah there are probably a couple good guys in the gang but unfortunately for them they choose to get involved with that group of punks and so they get stereotyped into that crowd. I say good job on the guy that turned himself in though.

[snrusnak]

Exactly. One picture does not prove anything on either side of the story. If you read it all and look at all the pictures, video, info, and don't take things out of context, there's only one logical conclusion. I'm glad the police are pursuing so aggressively. When things like this happen and people get off light it only sparks more people to do similar things because there aren't consequences.

[anrkizm95]

you'll get no sympathy from me with that.when you lay with dogs you get fleas

[rah7777777]

Try to attack me in the middle of the highway with my family in the car and I'll try my best to make sure you don't need any machines hooked up to you. (Like the guy above)....

....Just a sheet over your head.

[d_adams]

+1 rah7777777

[jasonxb9]

Grego, you are entitled to your opinion not matter how insanely flawed and ridiculous!! You say that tthey were only going after the driver, well how about when they shattered the window, glass flying everywhere in the car! The mental trauma of seeing what happened to the father? I think you should probably rethink your position. I don't like the fact that anyone got hurt in this but the bikers in this situation should be punished to the full extent of the law and as for the guys that got hurt, well its really their own fault for being so stupid to even get involved. And for the guy that said earlier that he would have even beat the wife for making a noise while you were beating her husband, you are a special kind of stupid!!

[Tbone]

I am biased, my son was in his early 20's when he was hit on the service road of 190 in Dallas on his Ninja. A car ran the stop sign and t boned him at a high rate of speed and did not stop. The car driver dragged the Ninja for over a quarter mile before he stopped just to get the bike unembedded from his car down the service road. He kept fleeing and did not look back. How I know this is a lady in her mini-van with her husband and children were directly behind my son when it happened and got all the details including the make, color and partial license plate of the car. The husband was a biker and also rode a Ninja just like my son, he said what he had seen that car do appeared to target my son on the motorcycle since the car appeared to speed up as to make the connection with the motorcycle. The husband told me that after witnessing what happened there is no telling what he would have done to the driver of the car after what he witnessed. This guy was a total stranger to my son, so I imagine if he was a friend, a brother, or a father. It is universal you don't hit or run over people for any reason as the reaction will be the same, regardless of the facts, situations, laws broken, rules followed, etc... you don't run over people period. Driving is not a right, it is a privilege in this country that many people lose. When you get a license it gives you the privilege to drive a car, not the right to run over people in any circumstance period! Again I am biased.

[go cytocis]

Again - the bikers (and yes I paint the entire group with the INTENT TO DO HARM brush) wanted to do harm....Someone was hurt, yes.Â* But that was due to the ENTIRE GROUP OF RIDERS - yes every last one of them - being involved in illegal activities.Â* Is there something you aren't comprehending about this?
Lotus, your'e aware that being arrogant and being right are not the same things, yes? [confused]

The law sees each of the bikers as free individuals, some of them punishable, others innocent, and so do I.:p

[snrusnak]

Tbone, That sucks about what happened, but it's entirely different from the situation here.

[oh9bolt]

Apparently you are not allowed to be on the road when they are and if you are you will get punked and have your car punched. These guys are a bunch of dickheads.

0ujSkztMRrs

[SEXT9]

When you get a license it gives you the privilege to drive a car, not the right to run over people in any circumstance period! Again I am biased.

That's exactly right there 'TBone'. And Edwin Mieses Jr, the person who got run over, lost that privilege some time ago. Andover Police Log (http://www.andovertownsman.com/local/x2026367045/Police-Log/print). Interesting he was arrested along with Jesus Jones who had an outstanding warrant.

None of those people riding in that mob had any regard for themselves, the law, the people they ride with, or anyone else. Take off the blinders and watch their rides. With that many people, committing that many traffic violations in that traffic, someone is bound to get hurt. They aren't sensitive to anyone else on the roads, so why should we feel any empathy towards them?

[oh9bolt]

[up][up][up][up]

[Dave A]

I can't believe any of those riders cared about who was run over. It was just false loyalty and an excuse to act out.

[theoctopus]

Watching these videos, it's no wonder my insurance premiums are so high.

[snrusnak]

It's a shame residence of NYC can't carry. There'd be significantly less of what's in that video ^.

As the biker's mother said "the media is making it out that the biker's are the bad guys, but they are the good guys". Ok mam...

[Theycallmecrash]

Grego.... Just stop posting....

Seriously will a mod lock this thread?!? Already. Not for censorship, just to end this, dare i say? "arguement". (More like a one-sided beat down, 1190rs vs a blast on the track. Grego being the blast of course and Shawn Higbee on the 1190)

[jetlee]

Just getting my $.02 in here before the lock...

Right at 0:29 you can see one of the riders jerking from the SUV as if he's trying to yank the door open. A couple more yanks and the SUV takes off. One rider, white/orange bike, even moves out of the way as if it's apparent the SUV is going to try to leave.

If a group of bikers did that to me, and tried to gain entry into my vehicle like that, I'd do the same.

[rah7777777]

While I don't agree with anything that grego has said in here, he's trying to prove a valid point in the above videos.

We think it will all play out one way in our heads and in reality it probably would not play out that way. Now it might be a better or worse way, who knows...

I've gone over scenarios in my head a 100 times on what I think I would do in different cases and it wouldn't take much to change them to a completely different outcome.

Just be safe guys and girls. Use your best judgment. Whether you want to stand outside your locked vehicle in the middle of the highway and get beat up or decide to push some folks out of your way or decide to shoot someone... just be careful and in the end its the judicial system that will say good job or your an idiot, if things go okay and you make it out alive of whatever situation it is.

[lotusexcelle]

Lotus, your'e aware that being arrogant and being right are not the same things, yes?

The law sees each of the bikers as free individuals, some of them punishable, others innocent, and so do I.

Not sure I'm using the quote function correctly.
So in the 7 other videos you are saying that the guy that got run over was the ONE bike rider that didn't break multiple laws over a long period of time? If the law sees each biker individually - and I agree it should - then each and every biker on the video breaks more than a few laws. The man that was run over? He was trying to help a friend and that is the ONLY good decision he made that day. It is not arrogant to say that every last rider in that group was riding like a squid. There is a LOT of evidence for that.

I'll tell you what. You point out this rider, out of all of them, that didn't have a blatant disregard for others, the law, the safety of those around him, and I'll go back on my statement.

[SEXT9]

You know I have a post for Grego. You are making the same mistake the rest of those bikers did in the video. You don't know most of us. You don't know what we would do in that situation. You don't know what each of us is capable of. That's the same mentality those bikers had. They figured the gentleman in the Range Rover would just back down. And he didn't do what they thought he would. They underestimated him and it got one of them hurt.

[BuellyBagger]

On a lighter note... Is anyone else impressed at how well the range rover can drive directly over a motorcycle with out sustaining any mechanical damage. In the zombie apocalypse I am so hijacking a range rover!

Seriously though, looks to me like a few f#@k tards in the pack really did their duty of further sowering the public opinion of sport bike riders. Bravo, morons! I don't blame the rr driver for fleeing at all. Wish he could of done it without having to hurt someone, but he did what he had to.

[snrusnak]

On a lighter note... Is anyone else impressed at how well the range rover can drive directly over a motorcycle with out sustaining any mechanical damage. In the zombie apocalypse I am so hijacking a range rover!

My thoughts exactly. And going 4 miles on slashed tires at highway speeds? Good advertising. If only they used bullet proof glass... lol

[BuellsRuell]

Looks to me he would've wound up in a coma eventually anyway....(or worse- put an innocent cager in one):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDjV08KZpNA

A tool with "mAd 5K!LL5" is still a fawkin' TOOL.

[rah7777777]

Your awfully nice calling him a tool.

My choice of words isn't as nice :-)

[stopie20]

Having a wife (and mother to my children) that rides, this is one of my biggest concerns. While we don't ride with any clubs or sizable groups, I believe (and have seen) that in general drivers today will use their larger and safer vehicles to "bull" their way into and out of traffic, including groups of bikes.
I could only imagine if my wife were to stop and confront a driver after being cut-off, swerved at, or just plain pushed out of the way and was subsequently run-over, injured, or killed I would not be concerned with what my wife had done to "deserve" being run over at all.... That driver, I prey I never meet him, would not escape with his life.

[snrusnak]

Logic continues to fail :(

[oh9bolt]

Logic continues to fail

Yup.. [sad]

[jasonxb9]

It really is interesting to see how different the opinions are here. Anyone that thinks what those riders did is ok, is a little bit nuts. Like said above, logic seems to have escaped a large portion of the human race as of late!!! Wow is all I can say

[djs2k2]

Can this post be hijacked. We don't know all the fact's, and that is a fact. So please lets not continue flexing our internet muscles, and talk about something else. Like how is my smiley face going to recover from this stroke [smirk][confused]

[Tbone]

Well I dropped my motorcycle in the parking garage at work yesterday. 1 year and 13K miles no incidents until yesterday. A car pulled up and my bike was in the lane, he could have ran it over or gone around it if he wanted to do so, but he stopped. He got out and was wearing a business suite and looked like he was in his late 60's, he walks up and says drop the kick stand and he effortlessly stands the bike up. Asks me if I am alright and says he used to ride an old Indian. Jumps back in his car and left. I have never met this person or rode with him, I may have seen him in the two years I have worked there going to and from the parking garage and that is it. Riding a motorcycle I feel there is a connection, a close knitted group of people that share the same joy. Just like I see here that there is a group of people that appear to like Range Rovers because of its ability to crush a few motorcycles and people, I will not be at your next rally. Hey if that is your thing, but I pray your not behind the next group ride I am in. Maybe I am naive and would have thought after being off a bike for 23 years that things were like they used to be. I guess I am old school and ride a Buell. Panic and fear cause people to act out, just like a rookie cop needs a wiser partner to put him in check, a good wife, mother, husband, brother, fellow biker, coworker, etc.. I would like to think I ride with people that have my back, even if I do wheelies on the highway, speed on the highway, go slow, cut someone off, run out gas, breakdown, crash, traffic may have to be stopped for a good or no good reason. Does that mean it is ok to run bikes and riders over intentionally?

[BuellsRuell]

Oh I think we know more than enough facts by now about this.

What would you like to know?? Perhaps I can be of assistance.

[09BuellXB9SX]

Murica?

[BuellsRuell]

Does that mean it is ok to run bikes and riders over intentionally?


If there are dozens of THUGS surrounding your vehicle and attempting to make you stop so they can beat/kill/rob you while your family is inside of it, then YES, it is ok.

I hope this helps!

[stopie20]

^^ My logic is this, if you use a vehicle to intentionally injure or kill a person it is no different than using a firearm. When using a firearm in self defense you are absolutely liable and accountable for injury to any person other than your attacker. In this case the biker that was was run over posed no immediate or life threatening danger to the driver and the driver should be held accountable for his actions.
"I was scared" is a sorry ****ing excuse.

The whole situation defies any logic or what we consider civility in this country period. The bikers could have called the police once they were run over, yes, but you are assuming that in Harlem these are stand up citizens with a solid moral compass?? You are also assuming that the police would have treated them fairly after their first friend had been hit?
Then you have the guy in the Range Rover, in the beginning you see as this group of bikes attempts to pass him he continues his attempts to drive among them. Did the driver not realize where he was? Did he not understand that his only option was to slow, and stop to allow them to pass?
Two points.
One, if you cant survive among the animals, stay the **** out of the jungle. I mean really, this was HARLEM, you aren't shocked by tourist beheadings in Mexico or Columbia are you?
Two, this sort of violent retaliation was a common response from bikers two decades ago, and whether it was right or wrong it kept bikers safe on the roads through drivers common fear of what a biker might do.

Bottom line, the whole situation is tragic, and no-one was in the right.

[s0dhi]

I would like to think I ride with people that have my back, even if I do wheelies on the highway, speed on the highway, go slow, cut someone off, run out gas, breakdown, crash, traffic may have to be stopped for a good or no good reason. Does that mean it is ok to run bikes and riders over intentionally?

Seems like the biker supporters are fixated on this incident from a motorcycle perspective.

So I'll ask the question... What if there were no motorcycles involved and an angry mob surrounded the SUV trying to get in and someone in front of the SUV was struck? Perhaps on a city street. Does that change your perspective any? What if you're in the SUV and a mob is trying to open the doors and get at you and your family? What do you do in that case? Keep in mind that, ultimately, the windows were shattered and driver dragged out and beaten.

I don't think that this issue has much to do with motorcycling at all. There were thugs in a mob disregarding the law and bullying someone. The fact that they were on motorcycles is a footnote.

[Theycallmecrash]

Hey! 2014 calendar is up!!!! Lets focus on that!!!

[djs2k2]

"BuellsRuell"
OK, so what truly happened that day? Where did your information come from? Is this a matter of fact or opinion? Did your information come from a bystander, were you yourself on the ride, a passerby, the family in the car that was attacked, bikers on the ride, or a news source? I will also say that I am not saying that anything that occurred here seems to be justifiable. Let’s make that very clear. I don’t know because I wasn’t there.

[djs2k2]

"Theycallmecrash"

Thanks for humoring me. Yeah I want to post a nice pic I have but its on my thumb drive at home so I will have to wait until I get there to post it. [up]

[BuddhaBuell]

hey remember why we all belong to this forum??

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/5248_20100921152327_L.jpg

http://www.buellxb.com/buell_images/5248_20091129102415_L.jpg

[snrusnak]

^^ My logic is this, if you use a vehicle to intentionally injure or kill a person it is no different than using a firearm. When using a firearm in self defense you are absolutely liable and accountable for injury to any person other than your attacker. In this case the biker that was was run over posed no immediate or life threatening danger to the driver and the driver should be held accountable for his actions.

Interesting post [up]

However the driver is still in the right. Think of it more like a robber breaking your door down at 2 in the morning, another guy follows behind him into your family room. The first guy points a gun at you. You shoot both of them. You are not arrested. The second guy only followed him in to the house, he didn't do anything, but you are justified to stop both.

[stopie20]

However the driver is still in the right.Â* Think of it more like a robber breaking your door down at 2 in the morning, another guy follows behind him into your family room.Â* The first guy points a gun at you.Â* You shoot both of them.Â* You are not arrested.Â* The second guy only followed him in to the house, he didn't do anything, but you are justified to stop both.

I see what you mean, but the guys in front of the SUV had only been obstructing traffic (from a legal stand point) where as the second individual to enter your home has done just that, entered your home and thus has become a threat. I would liken the biker in front of the SUV more to the "third guy" who is unarmed, standing in the middle of your front yard acting as a look out for the first two. If you, after downing the two assailants, exit your home, shoot and kill the guy in your front yard you have become the aggressor and have committed murder. You would only be exonerated if he had pursued you inside your home or charged you with a weapon.

[s0dhi]

I see what you mean, but the guys in front of the SUV had only been obstructing traffic (from a legal stand point) where as the second individual to enter your home has done just that, entered your home and thus has become a threat. I would liken the biker in front of the SUV more to the "third guy" who is unarmed, standing in the middle of your front yard acting as a look out for the first two. If you, after downing the two assailants, exit your home, shootÂ* and kill the guy in your front yard you have become the aggressor and have committed murder. You would only be exonerated if he had pursued you inside your home or charged you with a weapon.

The lines are blurry, but this incident seems to fit better into the classification of a Riot (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2102).

Under that definition, I'm not sure if the folks in front of the SUV are just blocking traffic.

[snrusnak]

The way I look at it, the guys in front were accessories, as they were helping the others try to hurt the man. They were purposely blocking the vehicle to allow the others to damage the vehicle and punch the window in the attempt to harm the man.

No matter what your opinion, I think everyone will agree the guys in front are complete morons. Who tries to stop a vehicle with a motorcycle and/or body. You can't win that fight.

On a side note, I got run off the road on my bike yesterday by a lady who was texting, didn't look, and didn't use a signal. This was on the day they made texting and driving illegal(found that ironic. also ironic that they made that a law since it's already illegal being that driving distracted is illegal...) :(

[BuellyBagger]

The answer to the argument boils down to the ten commandments: do unto others...
Maybe they should leave those up in front of the courthouse. Just a thought.
Or is that the"golden rule"? Either way you get the point.

[snrusnak]

I'm not a religious person but I'll second the "do unto others" [up]

[BuellyBagger]

I'm not really religious either they just seem like a good set of guide lines

[djs2k2]

See if we can agree on this http://www.buellxb.com/Buell-XB-Forum/Users-Bikes/GOV-shut-down-opinions

[theoctopus]

Great job djs2k2. Start flame thread #2.

[d_adams]

The fact that they were on motorcycles is a footnote.

I must say, that has got to be _the_ most astute observation up to this point. They could have been in cars, suv's, trucks or even on foot. It does not matter what they were in/on, plain and simple, they were attempting to harm the suv driver.

I'll say it again.

If I were in that situation and they were trying to get into my vehicle, I WOULD HAVE SHOT FIRST AND ASKED QUESTIONS LATER. If needed, my wife would be handing me magazines as required, if not shooting them herself. If the kids are in the vehicle, they can shoot as well.

[snrusnak]

^mr. tough guy here... you must have just watched some action movies mr. tough guy.

;)

[d_adams]

Nope, I just value the life and safety of my family.

[snrusnak]

I know, I was teasing :D

[go cytocis]

I'll tell you what. Â*You point out this rider, out of all of them, that didn't have a blatant disregard for others, the law, the safety of those around him, and I'll go back on my statement.
I can not, nor is it my place, or anyone else's place, to prove that anyone in that video is not guilty.
Fortunately we live in a system that assumes innocence. The burden is actually on you, Lotus, to prove that ALL participants in that ride are guilty before I'm prepared to buy into the 'lynch em all' mindset. Otherwise I'll stick with due-process.:D

[d_adams]

Btw, I asked my wife for her opinion on all this crap. That's how I know for sure she'd either hand me mags or shoot for herself. Luckily for us, a ccw is not required to actually carry in a vehicle where we live, even though I have mine. She's getting hers next and assuming the laws go into effect here for the lowered age for ccw, all of my kids will be getting theirs.

I'm just hoping 81 rounds is enough until I get more mags, that's all I can carry loaded right now.

[djs2k2]

Use the kid in the back to reload empty mags, and wife to hand you full ones. I'm just trying to resolve your issue without wasting money use the money you save on mags and buy more ammo. Just saying. [up]
Not condoning violence but I love my guns and thats even if I'm on my bike I carry.

[d_adams]

I just bought a Dillon 550, so I'll eventually save some money there, but it will take a little while to recuperate what I just spent on that setup.

[Tbone]

Thanks stopie20,
You got my vote on that one. I was not able to express how you broke it down so eloquently. Just something you learn through experience and not always easy to explain. Thanks again.

[djs2k2]

Sig AR15 magpul out, tons of magazines,1point sling, Scope, holographic sights, 1700rds, taurus 24/7 pro stainless steel, high capacity mag, hydro shock loaded, 200rds, .22 long rifle holds 17 semi, 1000rds,and bullet proof sapi plates. Being safe and able to fight back when you need to priceless!

[lotusexcelle]

Can I sum up the "moderate" view thusly?:

I was just talking to someone about how, on a 6800 mile trip, I didn't once drop my bike, cause a traffic issue, get too close to a vehicle, or otherwise endanger myself or others. I wanted to make it home. I absolutely do not think the injured motorcyclist "deserved" to get run over. But certainly the odds were against everyone in that group - someone, eventually, was going to get injured. That it happened to someone that was (according to reports) trying to assist someone else is definitely not good. But the blame for his injuries rests on the shoulders of his group of motorcyclists, not the SUV driver.



The massively injured rider was reportedly also riding on a suspended license. I'm not sure how I feel about that. Should that be considered a strike against him? I'm not so sure. I would say that his actions *that day* are what should be considered, not what he might have done prior. Same goes for the rider that brake-checked the SUV and lit the fuse on the rest of the events. I really don't care what his background is, criminal or not. His actions *that day* were sketchy and I'd like him to be judged solely on that.



I've read posts about the two injured motorcyclists, their police records, etc. I really wish it wouldn't get brought up. It doesn't matter. What matters is what happened that got those two guys injured, and a third man slashed and beaten. Zoom out from motorcycles. Take away the SUV. What you have is a riot in the street and a man trying to escape. Hell I don't even care that his family was with him. To me that doesn't even come into play. If he was alone his escape attempt was justified.

[djs2k2]

More guns = less crime. Not a joke its a fact. Ask Texas and any other US state that have loosened there law on firearms![up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up][up]

[poppinsexz]

I love to read some of the stupid.

As for the RR driver, mistake 1- getting off open road.
mistake 2- not using reverse once having been stopped.

As for squids/punks- to much stupid to count.

unfortunately the majority will get away scot free.

[rah7777777]

I'm in Texas, I love my guns... But we still have a ton of idiots running around.

We can't open carry (which I would not do even if I could) so maybe that's part of it. :-)

I firmly believe a gun should never be used as a scare tactic. It should be a last resort item and no one should ever know you have a firearm until they hear a click and boom ( if you have to pull it out in the first place )

So if it's bad enough to pull the weapon, it's probably going to be fired.

[djs2k2]

I prefer them not hear the boom if they hear it I missed.:D

[anrkizm95]

Ask Texas
if that happened here there would have been more bikers killed either the driver of the suv would have been armed or a person on the street would have put a stop to it when they started breaking his windows out.

[djs2k2]

O boy, I wish that jack ass piers morgan could read this. :D
You have to wonder on that note is piers morgan stupid enough to argue about guns with a group of armed gun owners in the middle of somewhere well hidden?

[Tbone]

I remember a town in Illinois called Downers Grove, that had a lot of guns and they outlawed them in the town and as a resident I think you had to turn them in somewhere or just get rid of them, vague memory. Being within striking distance of Chicago the crime rate shot up. Of the residents who stayed, as some left that city, trained guard dogs became a commodity there as well as refined dog training techniques. This city shot up as one of the safest and preferred places to live. I just remember going there as a kid and seeing a lot of German Shephards, Dobermans, St Barnards, etc.... Growing up in Chicago my family had a single trained German Shephard from DG & he did some amazing stuff. He broke off a heavy chain and ran over a mile to Kennedy high school to protect my twin cousins when they were being jumped by a gang. This dog kicked A55!!! 125 lb pound can of whoop a55.

[djs2k2]

Sorry, am I going to trust my life with a dog vs an attacker or a gun? Gun wins every time.[smirk]

[rah7777777]

I'd like both... Gun and big dog. Haha!

You don't see the K9 cops leaving their guns at home do you.

[djs2k2]

rah7777777 [up]

[BuddhaBuell]

I'd like both... Gun and big dog.

We live very far away from any urban centre,
we have 6 dogs...
..they are all armed
:D

[wolfo68]

We have actually had some douche up here that has been driving around in his truck pulling his gun on bikers. I don't think anything has ever come of it other than the guy pulling the gun to scare people, but it's on riders that are being responsible and some of us actually carry. I know he's had one mirror knocked off because someone saw what was going on and did the necessary to divert his attention from other riders.

****ty situations are everywhere this summer it seems.

[wolfo68]

How many times have you heard of a civilian stopping a guy with a rifle or an unholstered pistol?

It happens, it just doesn't get reported.

[Tbone]

It would be interesting to see some stats on that, I really do not have a preference or knowledge just some experience with a K9. For close quarter protection I think a well trained canine might be up there, wish I had the data so I could respond better.

[wolfo68]

I'd be okay with a canine if I wasn't allergic, but it would keep me out of some pain from being shot again.

[snrusnak]

Colorado James Holmes movie theater massacre.
Columbine.
Virginia Tech.
Waco Texas. And FREQUENT 4-5 kill shooting sprees, like just recently in the news.
Hennard, George Pierre, Texas, 23 kills.
Unruh, Howard Barton, NJ 13 kills
Pough, James Edward, Florida 11kills
McLendon, Michael Kenneth 10 kills Alabama

The list goes on and on and on to include KS, WY, NE, UT, AK, MS, MO, GA, etc. etc. etc.

grego is either a politician or one of the bikers in the video.

[d_adams]

More guns = less violence? Hm not sure I agree with that.

Colorado James Holmes movie theater massacre.
Columbine.
Virginia Tech.

Ok, I will stop here, it's pointless to go any further along this path. Cite shootings. IN NO GUN ZONES. Yeah, how did that work out for them? Just ONE person there with a CCW could have put a stop to every one that you listed. JUST ONE. That's all it takes is one armed citizen. Cops weren't around, it was a posted gun free zone. You think that criminals give a **** about laws if they're getting ready to commit a crime? Didn't think so. You need to get a grip on reality pretty soon, maybe wake up from your dream world.

I live in a relatively low crime rate area, it has a fairly high percentage of police roaming about, but even with a 3-4 minute response time, it's too damn late for them to do anything more than fill out a report if there's someone out to cause mischief. Arm yourself and be prepared to defend yourself and loved ones.

[anrkizm95]

I personally LOVE the fact that NY has the strictest gun laws in the country. I feel MUCH safer.roflmmfao says the guy living in one of the cities with the toughest gun laws and highest crime.

http://smileys.smilchat.net/emoticon/blue/3dgrosbleu2.gif

[djs2k2]

Sorry grego you dont help your case these were all places that dont allow guns, and you fell safer in new york where they have the strictest gun laws? Wait a sec isnt this where the incident happened? You confused me Grego.

[anrkizm95]

NYC is actually 46 on the list of cities with the highest crime rate in 2011.

These nine cities account for 5.9% of the U.S. population and 20.7% of all the murders in the country.

City

Murders

Population

Per 100,000



Chicago

506

2,700,000


18.7



NYC

414

8,100,000

5.1



Detroit

411

707,000

58.1



Phila

331

1,540,000

21.5



St. Louis

113

318,000

35.5



Cleveland

97

394,000

24.6



New Orleans

193

361,000

53.5



Wash DC

88

618,000

14.2



Los Angeles

294

3,800,000

7.7

[djs2k2]

Next time you post about massacre's post somewhere that allows guns, and guns were present, and dont question the fact that some bases have been attacked because military personnel are not allowed to carry firearms on base.

[djs2k2]

My statement stand put guns in the hands of the good citizens of NYC and it would be an even lower number might go from 414 to a few accidental deaths, or how about this only deaths of bad people.

[anrkizm95]

WTF is your point?

Violent crime rate in 2011


New York:


336.8


U.S. Average:


213.6


Violent crime rate in 2010


New York:


315.1


U.S. Average:


223.2


Violent crime rate in 2009


New York:


297.2


U.S. Average:


238.0


Violent crime rate in 2008


New York:


313.2


U.S. Average:


252.4


Violent crime rate in 2007


New York:


330.0


U.S. Average:


259.7


Violent crime rate in 2006


New York:


345.7


U.S. Average:


264.1


Violent crime rate in 2005


New York:


364.9


U.S. Average:


258.9


Violent crime rate in 2004


New York:


373.0


U.S. Average:


256.0


Violent crime rate in 2003


New York:


398.6


U.S. Average:


262.6


Violent crime rate in 2002


New York:


427.5


U.S. Average:


272.2


Violent crime rate in 2000


New York:


526.4


U.S. Average:


277.6


Violent crime rate in 1999


New York:


571.8


U.S. Average:


286.4


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-New-York-New-York.html#ixzz2gbSSeSvf

[03Firebolt9R]

http://i1285.photobucket.com/albums/a600/pmcniel1/image_zps4048f0d1.jpg

[djs2k2]

Yeah NYC avg higher than national avg, and grego I respect your not wanting to have a gun but your only speaking for yourself. Ask yourself this if you lived in a good neighborhood miles from town and someone broke into your home with intent to hurt your family would you rather have a gun or a phone to call the police thats only minutes away when seconds count?

[djs2k2]

03Firebolt9r[up]

[djs2k2]

Grego thats why I love this forum [up]

[djs2k2]

Grego did you try to piss us gun lovers off by posting those comments while killing people on grand theft auto 5 with the use of a gun that you stole off a drug dealer trying to pick up a hooker at a local church?

[anrkizm95]

Im sorry I piss people off, but that's just me.
dont be sorry i piss people off on an hourly basis as long as its not my wife i could care less.

[djs2k2]

Happy wife, happy life.

[anrkizm95]

Happy wife, happy life.[up]

[ali]

hahahahahahaha this is great

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151704176487972&set=vb.308506372538478&type=2&theater

[BuellsRuell]

I personally LOVE the fact that NY has the strictest gun laws in the country. I feel MUCH safer.

yeah...cuz' we all know that criminals abide by those strict gun laws, right?? smh

[theoctopus]

Every time someone brings up the "highest prevalence of violent crime/lowest prevalence of gun ownership" relationship, I feel like I need to have a conversation about statistics with them. A very rudimentary understanding of "correlation does not imply causation" makes even the biggest gun ownership proponents question that argument. There are a million confounding variables that likely better explain why metro centers have higher rates of violent crime per capita than their suburban or rural counterparts. It's fear mongering at its very core.

I'm a proud gun owner, too. That's just such a poor argument for why someone should own a gun.

[BuellyBagger]

theoctopus is on the money there, everyone knows that 7 of 10 statistics are bull ****!!! :D

btw im also a gun owner, and would own more if my wife didn't "need" a boat!

[ztied]

It`s not the guns that do the killing,It` the pussy gang banger punk **** with no balls,that needs a gun to be bad ass.Should we take his pencils because he can`t spell right.we know its the pencils fault.haha.
I am moving to the walgreens town thats perfect,nothing bad happens there. Perfectville.