New Guy

[FOKKER]

Hello all,
Like to thank the Forum for allowing me to join. I just wanted to say hello to all. I have been looking at the Buell for many years while I was riding Harleys and a few old triumphs and a Z750S that I currently have for sale. For sale because I just picked up a 2004 Buell XB12R last night with 16000 km (9900 miles) on it. Got it for $1800 canadian $1350 US dollars. I did buy it with a known problem which I will begin to work on today. Bike is hard to put into gear and when you do it makes quite a loud noise. No noise in neutral. So far I’m thinking clutch is sticking or warped, possible primary chain issue. We will see. If anyone has experience with this I appreciate the input. I will post pictures once I clean her up a bit.
Thanks.

 

[34nineteen]

Hello all,
Like to thank the Forum for allowing me to join. I just wanted to say hello to all. I have been looking at the Buell for many years while I was riding Harleys and a few old triumphs and a Z750S that I currently have for sale. For sale because I just picked up a 2004 Buell XB12R last night with 16000 km (9900 miles) on it. Got it for $1800 canadian $1350 US dollars. I did buy it with a known problem which I will begin to work on today. Bike is hard to put into gear and when you do it makes quite a loud noise. No noise in neutral. So far I’m thinking clutch is sticking or warped, possible primary chain issue. We will see. If anyone has experience with this I appreciate the input. I will post pictures once I clean her up a bit.
Thanks.

Another known issue is that these gear boxes are noisy and clunky. If you have read any of the the reviews or articles, they almost always touch upon that.

Anyhow.

1. Make sure the clutch is adjusted correctly.
2. Make sure the cable is adjusted correctly.
3. Make sure the primary chain is adjusted correctly.
4. Change your primary fluid. I prefer HD Formula +, others swear that Amsoil improves shift quality.


The 06-later bikes had revised gear boxes which shift much better than the earlier ones, but its no where near the shift quality of a CBR600.


If you want to pull the primary cover off, no one will stop you. My S1 was having trouble finding neutral, and pulling the primary exposed a whole slew of other problems I'm glad I'm catching now rather than just "dealing with it as I ride".

 

[Barrett]

Sir: follow Aaron's instructions above which are a great starting point. if you don't have a service manual, simply click the link below and download the correct one for your 2004 firebolt. these transmissions are very similar in style, content, maintenance and feel to most all sportster and XR1200 transmissions/primary assemblies.
if you perform the following in conjunction with what Aaron mentioned, the trans and clutch should both work very nicely. will NEVER be jap-bike-like smooth...but will work well once you learn the proper shifting procedure.
as follows:
lube clutch lever/perch assembly
lube clutch cable
adjust clutch cable and clutch pack properly and as one complete operation
adjust primary drive chain at room temperature. one-half inch of slack will be fine as per SM
drain primary fluid and replace O-ring on drain plug. it is the same O-ring and same plug as the swingarm/engine oil drain plug
drain the primary fluid. a full drain takes approx. 1 hour with bike in near-vertical position
refill primary with a top-quality 20W50 motorcycle specific oil RATED JASO-MA or higher ONLY! this rating means the oil is compatible with wet clutches, which your XB has. do NOT use REDLINE in the primary as it has a history of causing stator problems. MOBIL-1 motorcycle specific or AMSOIL primary/trans specific oils both work very well in these primaries.

lastly: after performing all of the above and you still find neutral difficult to locate....bulky erratic shifting....clutch dragging and not yielding full disengagment....clutch only starts to engage near end of lever throw....then the clutch will need replaced as you have burned/warped metal clutch pack drive plates along with diaphragm spring at the end of its life.
ENERGY ONE COMPANY makes a very nice replacement complete clutch kit. XL AND XR NOT the same.
CAUTION: DO NOT OVER-TIGHTEN EITHER PLUG OR YOU'LL EASILY STRIP OUT THE ALUMINUM THREADS THAT AFFIX THE PLUG TO THE ASSEMBLY!

https://www.buellmods.com/

 

[34nineteen]

Sir: follow Aaron's instructions above which are a great starting point. if you don't have a service manual, simply click the link below and download the correct one for your 2004 firebolt. these transmissions are very similar in style, content, maintenance and feel to most all sportster and XR1200 transmissions/primary assemblies.
if you perform the following in conjunction with what Aaron mentioned, the trans and clutch should both work very nicely. will NEVER be jap-bike-like smooth...but will work well once you learn the proper shifting procedure.
as follows:
lube clutch lever/perch assembly
lube clutch cable
adjust clutch cable and clutch pack properly and as one complete operation
adjust primary drive chain at room temperature. one-half inch of slack will be fine as per SM
drain primary fluid and replace O-ring on drain plug. it is the same O-ring and same plug as the swingarm/engine oil drain plug
drain the primary fluid. a full drain takes approx. 1 hour with bike in near-vertical position
refill primary with a top-quality 20W50 motorcycle specific oil RATED JASO-MA or higher ONLY! this rating means the oil is compatible with wet clutches, which your XB has. do NOT use REDLINE in the primary as it has a history of causing stator problems. MOBIL-1 motorcycle specific or AMSOIL primary/trans specific oils both work very well in these primaries.

lastly: after performing all of the above and you still find neutral difficult to locate....bulky erratic shifting....clutch dragging and not yielding full disengagment....clutch only starts to engage near end of lever throw....then the clutch will need replaced as you have burned/warped metal clutch pack drive plates along with diaphragm spring at the end of its life.
ENERGY ONE COMPANY makes a very nice replacement complete clutch kit. XL AND XR NOT the same.
CAUTION: DO NOT OVER-TIGHTEN EITHER PLUG OR YOU'LL EASILY STRIP OUT THE ALUMINUM THREADS THAT AFFIX THE PLUG TO THE ASSEMBLY!

https://www.buellmods.com/

^^^^^^^^^^
Buell Whisperer

 

[FOKKER]

Thanks all for the input. I might be getting deeper then I want, but here we go. Removed primary. Unable to get bike back into neutral. I did get it to go down the road in first. Would not shift at all. Shifter was like it was locked in place. The shifter rod that comes through primary is loose and you can slide it in and out just have not removed it yet. That is with primary cover off. I will need to replace that because the end is stripped. I will try to attach pictures. Next attempt is to remove clutch. Should the whole basket be pulled or can I just remove the individual plates

 

[FOKKER]

Forgot to add. Was some metal in primary cover and on drain bolt. That normal for these bikes ?

 

[FOKKER]

I did manage to get it back into neutral with channel lock pliers.

 

[34nineteen]

Will the bike shift when the engine is off? My S1 is doing something similar and its kind of a mess in the primary. I am pulling it apart now to clean, inspect and make sure its put back together properly.

Yes, a little bit of metal shavings is normal... and when I drained my primary it looked acceptable. But when I pulled the cover off, there was much more than I am comfortable with, so I will be pulling the transmission out as well for cleaning.

 

[Sdrxb12s]

I've never seen inside the cover but those two drill Mark's dont look normal. ??? Not sure but looks funny to me. Second do yourself a favor and throw the channel locks in the corner and dont use them anymore they destroy everything and should not be used on anything you care about. Ie. your bike. Just my opinion.

 

[kz6fittycent]

I've never seen inside the cover but those two drill Mark's dont look normal. ??? Not sure but looks funny to me. Second do yourself a favor and throw the channel locks in the corner and dont use them anymore they destroy everything and should not be used on anything you care about. Ie. your bike. Just my opinion.

That's from balancing - they remove material from the factory to balance. Lot's of engine/parts that spin will have that same tooling. Sometimes they add weight but typically, they try to remove it.

 

[Sdrxb12s]

That's from balancing - they remove material from the factory to balance. Lot's of engine/parts that spin will have that same tooling. Sometimes they add weight but typically, they try to remove it.

Ok cool thought about that but wasnt sure where they drilled into the writing

 

[FOKKER]

Thanks much. Yes some one has not been nice to this bike. It does run pretty good just sitting there �� I’m going to try and find a new shifter shaft in better shape. Check clutch plates,prob just replace them. Put back together and reevaluate the noises in the primary. Noise only shows up when you get it in gear and release the clutch. In neutral no noise. Maybe clutch plates are sticking if it has sat a while. Might be some of the issues putting it into gear. The shifter shaft was also scrap, the splines were stripped and linkage was slipping on the shaft, prob rotating 1/8 inch before moving the shaft.
Sorry for jumping around in the thread. It all got a little confusing for a bit, but after a good sleep ready to tackle again.
Where do you folks find most of your parts?
StPaul Harley Davidson seems to have some. Have not found a shifter shaft yet , or the c-clip for clutch.
Here is a photo of shifter shaft. Don’t think I can save it ��
Actually when I shifted it to neutral with primary cover off and holding shifter shaft by hand. It took very little force to slip it back to neutral, so that’s why I think noise may be in the clutch plates ?

 

[34nineteen]

If you can not save the shift shaft, it will set you back about $250, so I'd imagine, its in your best interest to try.

At this point, I would remove the primary sprockets and chain and inspect the end of the shift shaft that is behind the clutch basket. It seems like at least one of the springs may be distorted. There is a thread on here about the springs and orientation of the pawls on the shift shaft. Compare the spring that you can see in your pic to these, granted one is disconnected, but you should get the idea.

Also, that looks like a lot of shavings on the bottom of your case.

 

[FOKKER]

Yes I also noticed that. I was hoping that it is from the clutch plates and will explain the noise I have. �� we will see when I get the clutch off. I have seen a couple of home made clutch compression tools on here. Seen lots on eBay but all seem too say only up to 2001 Buell models. What have you used ?

 

[FOKKER]

Made some progress today. Wanted to show pictures of the clutch plates and the free play in the clutch end of the case. Some good news. Local Harley dealer still supports the Buell product was able to order new shifter shaft and other parts.
One picture is plates. They all look like this. Other is in a mirror, picture of springs and pawls on shifter shaft. The rear sprocket will be tough to remove last guy did nice job rounding off the corners of the nut
The rear gear has some wiggle in it. Is this normal. Video I took will not upload I will keep trying. It moves maybe 1/16 inch. ??
Measured fibre plates. All are .078-.085 measured in 3 different spots each

 

[Barrett]

he rear gear has some wiggle in it. Is this normal.

NO. it's not a "rear gear". it's the clutch basket assembly. built-in damper spring assemblies clue that it's a true XB basket

It moves maybe 1/16 inch. ??

see schematic. #30 possibly missing..substituted...severely worn from prior idiot wrenching. same idiot who tore up #23 & 24

Measured fibre plates. All are .078-.085 measured in 3 different spots each

completely irrelevant. it is the total STACK HEIGHT of the clutch pack that determines acceptable minimal thickness. ALL covered in SM.

NOTE: REFER TO TSB dated 9-16-2005 #TT-211 for important updates to this entire procedure.

 

[FOKKER]

Ok thanks. Shop manual gave me the min thickness of 0.661 that’s why I gave that measurement. Just going to replace the stack. Any recommendations on who to get new plates from? Also pull rear basket assembly off as you described it. To put new shifter rod in. Apologies if I miss name parts or ask questions. I’m just jumping into this and trying to learn it. idea behind this bike was a project to learn the deeper workings of the motorcycle.

 

[34nineteen]

I would reach out to Dan at NRHS for a replacement clutch. He is very knowledgeable with Buells and very helpful. Good guy!

 

[34nineteen]

I would reach out to Dan at NRHS for a replacement clutch. He is very knowledgeable with Buells and very helpful. Good guy!

also, be aware that you will have to reinstall those clutch plates to remove the nut to remove the clutch basket. IIRC it is a left hand thread.

 

[kz6fittycent]

Ok thanks. Shop manual gave me the min thickness of 0.661 that’s why I gave that measurement. Just going to replace the stack. Any recommendations on who to get new plates from? Also pull rear basket assembly off as you described it. To put new shifter rod in. Apologies if I miss name parts or ask questions. I’m just jumping into this and trying to learn it. idea behind this bike was a project to learn the deeper workings of the motorcycle.

I think it's cool you're willing to do it yourself. Many people just shrug their shoulders and call a mechanic - or sell the bike. Learning is always good IMO.

Just take your time, don't do anything unless you've researched it well and enjoy your bike. Working on the bike is part of the fun, I think.