Starter screeching/grinding - why?

[sailmoto]

Hey all,
I have an 08 1125r and just picked up an '09 XB12xt. Starting to service it, but my immediate concern is that sometimes the gears seem to slip when starting (including fresh off charger) - for maybe a fracton of a second before catching. AWFUL sound!

What components should I look at to service here?
Thanks for any help.
-sm

 

[user_deleted]

incredibly loose primary drive chain.....starter headed to starter graveyard.....starter over-run clutch. it's #12 in schematic. when it goes south it makes an incredible grinding/groaning/screeching noise and gets worse when motor is on hot-start mode. i'll take #12 for $200 Alex!

 

[Cooter]

I'll double the bet for (#12) Alex! That clutch will sound like death

 

[sailmoto]

Is that a starter clutch which is separate from the transmission clutch? Yes, it definitely happens when hot.

Lastly, how close am i to being stranded here? It happens maybe 50% of the time.

And the replacement would be just that part listed? #12

I won't send $200, or $400, but can promise to send a starbucks sized paypal gift for whoever got the right prediction on this one.
Thanks!

 

[Cooter]

Check the repair procedure in the service manual to prepare for the job. It will take at least a crank locking tool (you can make yourself).

You can find the manual download for free at Buellmods.com for Buelltooth.com

 

[user_deleted]

Is that a starter clutch which is separate from the transmission clutch? Yes, it definitely happens when hot.
if you're asking this question you do NOT have the mechanical aptitude, skills or knowledge to tackle this job.

And the replacement would be just that part listed? #12
yes. called starter drive clutch assembly in parts world slang. factory part #31663-90 and superseded later by #31556-91B


Lastly, how close am i to being stranded here? It happens maybe 50% of the time.
odds of being stranded are about the same as a guy who continues to ride with a terminally ill battery that will only start his bike after being on a "tender" overnite.

you would be best served by shopping around locally for either a privateer or shop that knows Sportsters and their starter systems well as yours' is one and the same. and if they recommend replacing entire starter steer clear of cheapo garbage aftermarket crap. still to this day the OEM starter remains the finest i've ever seen.

 

[sailmoto]

Is that a starter clutch which is separate from the transmission clutch? Yes, it definitely happens when hot.
if you're asking this question you do NOT have the mechanical aptitude, skills or knowledge to tackle this job.

And the replacement would be just that part listed? #12
yes. called starter drive clutch assembly in parts world slang. factory part #31663-90 and superseded later by #31556-91B


Lastly, how close am i to being stranded here? It happens maybe 50% of the time.
odds of being stranded are about the same as a guy who continues to ride with a terminally ill battery that will only start his bike after being on a "tender" overnite.

you would be best served by shopping around locally for either a privateer or shop that knows Sportsters and their starter systems well as yours' is one and the same. and if they recommend replacing entire starter steer clear of cheapo garbage aftermarket crap. still to this day the OEM starter remains the finest i've ever seen.

I would suggest the same based on my lack of lingo (and especially wrt life efficiency...but that's another thread, and forum...), but at the end of the day as an engineer, a diy guy, and as someone who wants to know how to maintain these vehicles, I'm going to do this myself, logical decision or not. Bikes don't make much sense anyway after all.

The battery appears to be fine, but that is only based on cranking habits compared to youtube Ulys, and resting voltage. Tender hasn't been needed for anything. Ulys seem to have a rep for hard starting.

Anyway I appreciate the help, will update after the replacement.

 

[sailmoto]

Also, interestingly, the problem has not happened since replacing the years old old oil, causal or not.

 

[Cooter]

Bikes don't make much sense anyway after all.

I applaud the willingness to DIY something, but that is a scary sentence.

If you prep correctly for the job and read through the procedure in the service manual not youtube it is pretty straight forward. If you get stuck, we're here to help.

 

[34nineteen]

incredibly loose primary drive chain.....starter headed to starter graveyard.....starter over-run clutch. it's #12 in schematic. when it goes south it makes an incredible grinding/groaning/screeching noise and gets worse when motor is on hot-start mode. i'll take #12 for $200 Alex!

View attachment 9758

Herr Buell-whisperer,

How would a loose primary chain cause a screech or a grind with the starter??

I'm not doubting your wisdom, as you are as wise as you are great. Teach me Sensei. :eagerness:

 

[TPEHAK]

Primary chain does not affect starter.

 

[Cooter]

A questionable primary chain will rattle and make noise as the engine is turning. You can hear it better if the bike is just cranking and not running loudly.

I had a Kawi Ninja 1000R in 1986 that had a chain driven off the starter sprag and liked to snap them Had to listen to the warning signs because when it broke, it would settle in the bottom of the case and do some damage.

 

[user_deleted]

Herr Buell-whisperer,

How would a loose primary chain cause a screech or a grind with the starter??

I'm not doubting your wisdom, as you are as wise as you are great. Teach me Sensei. :eagerness:

aaron: contrary to what buffoon TEABAG added as per his latest troll...the primary chain is in fact part of the starting system. if not for the chain the power of the starter would NOT be transferred to the crankshaft itself spinning the motor over. have seen a few XB's thru the years with incredibly loose primary chains not only add to the "compression bump" problem but also make one hell of a racket when in crank-to-start mode. that is why i mentioned it. takes 45 seconds to check so worth mentioning to the guy with the noise question.

 

[34nineteen]

aaron: contrary to what buffoon TEABAG added as per his latest troll...the primary chain is in fact part of the starting system. if not for the chain the power of the starter would NOT be transferred to the crankshaft itself spinning the motor over. have seen a few XB's thru the years with incredibly loose primary chains not only add to the "compression bump" problem but also make one hell of a racket when in crank-to-start mode. that is why i mentioned it. takes 45 seconds to check so worth mentioning to the guy with the noise question.

Ah, good point! I didn't consider that. :eagerness:

 

[TPEHAK]

You don't need even check if primary is extremely loose, if it is the motorcycle moves jerky.

 

[ChiTownEngineer]

You don't need even check if primary is extremely loose, if it is the motorcycle moves jerky.

"Jerky"..... as in Beef Jerky??? Interesting concept.

 

[TPEHAK]

Choppy, shaking back and forth. You will definitely know if the primary chain is extremely loose.

 

[user_deleted]

"Jerky"..... as in Beef Jerky??? Interesting concept.

LOL. chris.....where the hell have you been son?????????

 

[ChiTownEngineer]

LOL. chris.....where the hell have you been son?????????

I've been around, popping in now and then like a thief in the night. Mostly to learn from the wisdom of TPEHAK.

 

[34nineteen]

"Jerky"..... as in Beef Jerky??? Interesting concept.

I love beef jerky! I need to check my primary more often. Thanks for the tip!