Xb12r isolator mount

[mgmc]

hey guys, hitting you all up from Sydney, Australia. just left 2 of my local HD dealers and both advised HD is no longer importing the front isolator mount for my model.
the only second hand ones i have seen are either worse looking then the one im replacing or $12,000,000,000 per mount.
any aussie locals or internationals got one or possibly two spare isolator mounts i could buy from you? (the second is for a back up down the road)
anyway, id appreciate it alot if someone is able to help me out

 

[outthere]

for sale e-bay, new units for $140 US. https://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-Front-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

 

[rchuff]

I just got one off eBay nos for $95.00 plus shipping. The one Cooter found is a good price to would consider that one to. I tried a couple of dealers and was told NA.

 

[Mesozoic]

I think it may be time to design a process to renew the stock isolator mounts ourselves. Anyone familiar the rubber vulcanization process?

 

[34nineteen]

Or maybe the time to buy one or two before Vintage sells through them??? There are 72 left at Vintage.

It’s not like they are going to get less expensive if someone tries to reproduce them.

 

[Cooter]

How ironic. I just bought 71 engine isolators from them... Hmmm...

Guess the price is going up faster than we thought!

 

[Mesozoic]

Reproducing the metal framework isn’t very difficult, but I’m not sure about the rubber bit at all. A bit of context... I’m an engineer with access to numerous CNC machines. I’ve fabricated numerous components for my Buells and other vehicles from time to time. I use my XB daily since I bought it in 2007 and plan to continue doing so for the foreseeable future. At 50K miles on the odometer I’ve replaced the front isolator only once, but I’m also a cheapskate and won’t be paying $150 for a part that really costs about $20 in materials to manufacture. $60, sure, but that ain’t happenin these days.

 

[Cooter]

The CAD for the bracket has been done several times already, looks like you just volunteered to research bushings

 

[34nineteen]

Reproducing the metal framework isn’t very difficult, but I’m not sure about the rubber bit at all. A bit of context... I’m an engineer with access to numerous CNC machines. I’ve fabricated numerous components for my Buells and other vehicles from time to time. I use my XB daily since I bought it in 2007 and plan to continue doing so for the foreseeable future. At 50K miles on the odometer I’ve replaced the front isolator only once, but I’m also a cheapskate and won’t be paying $150 for a part that really costs about $20 in materials to manufacture. $60, sure, but that ain’t happenin these days.

Then why not go find a premade bushing and design a custom Cnc mount to fit it? I’d pay $60 for that, but it needs to exceed factory quality in every aspect.

Chop chop!!!

 

[Mesozoic]

I was thinking of simply replacing the existing rubber bushing on the stock piece if that's a possibility. That would certainly involve the least amount of work, but as Cooter suggested, requires researching what that vulcanization process might look like. It'll likely also involve removing the failed rubber material from the isolator assembly, which may or may not be a PITA.

 

[Cooter]

Why are you dwelling on our Vulcan friends? It's a rare process with instructions only passed down from the Vulcan Confederacy to worthy individuals who have passed Khans-wan:eagerness:

Or just find a bushing with an outer shell to press in, like a leaf spring bushing. Burn out the old one and Bam. Durometer is going to be VERY specific and probably even directional. Look at how the stock ones are made.




Gotta go, I'm late for Pon Farr

 

[34nineteen]

I was thinking of simply replacing the existing rubber bushing on the stock piece if that's a possibility. That would certainly involve the least amount of work, but as Cooter suggested, requires researching what that vulcanization process might look like. It'll likely also involve removing the failed rubber material from the isolator assembly, which may or may not be a PITA.

Reproducing the metal framework isn’t very difficult, but I’m not sure about the rubber bit at all. A bit of context... I’m an engineer with access to numerous CNC machines. I’ve fabricated numerous components for my Buells and other vehicles from time to time. I use my XB daily since I bought it in 2007 and plan to continue doing so for the foreseeable future. At 50K miles on the odometer I’ve replaced the front isolator only once, but I’m also a cheapskate and won’t be paying $150 for a part that really costs about $20 in materials to manufacture. $60, sure, but that ain’t happenin these days.

Why not just find a readily available bushing and redesign/modify the mount? Even you mention that redoing the metal part of the mount "isn't very difficult" and after all you are " and an engineer with access to numerous CNC machines" and have no issue "fabricating numerous components for your Buells and other vehicles" , but for some reason you are focused on reusing the metal parts and trying to redesign the bushing, which "you're not sure about at all" and "requires research into the vulcanization process" and "may or may not be a PITA".

 

[Mesozoic]

Why not just find a readily available bushing and redesign/modify the mount? Even you mention that redoing the metal part of the mount "isn't very difficult" and after all you are " and an engineer with access to numerous CNC machines" and have no issue "fabricating numerous components for your Buells and other vehicles" , but for some reason you are focused on reusing the metal parts and trying to redesign the bushing, which "you're not sure about at all" and "requires research into the vulcanization process" and "may or may not be a PITA".

If I had to redesign the isolator I'd have to model the entire frame like Buell did and run it through Cosmos or whatever CAD simulation software was used to isolate the vibrations - that is a full blown mechanical engineering team effort that takes months. The reason I would avoid re-engineering the metal assembly is because it has already been engineered and is a proven design. It will be simpler to deal with replacing the rubber insert and after all, we'd rather be riding than repairing our junk, right? I don't have any experience with rubber isolators, but I have good friends who do so will inquire with them in January when we return to work.

 

[34nineteen]

If I had to redesign the isolator I'd have to model the entire frame like Buell did and run it through Cosmos or whatever CAD simulation software was used to isolate the vibrations - that is a full blown mechanical engineering team effort that takes months. The reason I would avoid re-engineering the metal assembly is because it has already been engineered and is a proven design. It will be simpler to deal with replacing the rubber insert and after all, we'd rather be riding than repairing our junk, right? I don't have any experience with rubber isolators, but I have good friends who do so will inquire with them in January when we return to work.

Oh, ok... so this is going to require a team of engineers to modify a bracket that is already a proven design? I'm not an engineer, so I dont know these things. It seemed like reproducing the metal framework wouldnt be very difficult, especially knowing that you have fabricated many parts for Buells and other vehicles. Ok, well I am looking forward to seeing the fruits of this, so keep us posted.

 

[Cooter]

If I had to redesign the isolator I'd have to model the entire frame like Buell did and run it through Cosmos or whatever CAD simulation software was used to isolate the vibrations - that is a full blown mechanical engineering team effort that takes months. The reason I would avoid re-engineering the metal assembly is because it has already been engineered and is a proven design. It will be simpler to deal with replacing the rubber insert and after all, we'd rather be riding than repairing our junk, right? I don't have any experience with rubber isolators, but I have good friends who do so will inquire with them in January when we return to work.

You're making mountains from molehills.

Find a cheap bushing with the right durometer and approximate size, then (if you even have too) slightly modify the mount to accept it.
Here is one failed attempt. The link has the bracket CAD:
https://www.buellxb.com/forum/showthread.php?51131-Buell-XB-high-performance-front-isolator/page6
Perhaps a slight change to the ID of the big hole is all you need.
The aluminum isn't part of the flex design so you can leave Cosmos alone.

Or just buy one. Or two. Or ten.

 

[34nineteen]

Dammit Cooter, quit hacking up your El Camino and read what this guy took the time to spell out.

I'd have to model the entire frame like Buell did and run it through Cosmos or whatever CAD simulation software was used to isolate the vibrations - that is a full blown mechanical engineering team effort that takes months.

What part of "engineering team" and "months" do you not get?

Also, why are you so intent pushing your consumerism dogma on him? He's not going to spend $150 on a new one.

 

[Cooter]

He said "full blown" (snicker).

Because THAT doesn't happen too often to a mechanical engineer. (guffaw):black_eyed:

 

[34nineteen]

He said "full blown" (snicker).

Ha! Full blown. Thats some funny stuff right there.

 

[Mesozoic]

Erik Buell patented the isoplanar engine mounting system - it takes some effort (whether it's "full blown" or not is relative) to obtain a patent; it certainly required some good ol' analysis of some kind to figure out how much metal strength, stiffness, and the material selection that's appropriate for the application in addition to the rubber bit in there. I'm not qualified to match the design rigor used by Buell. A simple bushing replacement is as far as I would go before shelling out $150-200 for an eBay NOS part. These front isolator mounting assemblies are a bit of an Achilles heel for the XB, so until someone begins to market a replacement part, XBs are going to start becoming difficult to service.

Thanks for pointing out TPEHAK's attempt, I do recall that... the conclusion is basically that the isolator is a lot more complex than it looks, right?

 

[34nineteen]

the conclusion is basically that the isolator is a lot more complex than it looks, right?

so, what was all the business about being an engineer and having access to all these CNC machines and building all these custom parts for Buells and other vehicles?

This is like that Seinfeld episode where Kramer talks about building the "levels" but never does.