Sputters Stutters Sputters Stutters

[Tbone]

Just started the last 150 Miles of Riding: Does not want to idle and surges between 400 and 1400 rpms. Sputtering sounds in the air box accompanied with stuttering. Drove it the last 100 miles adding fresh gas and SeaFoam to the tank as I went and has no impact.

30 K Miles on the clock:
Things recently added
-New Battery-March 2014
-Last Oil and Filter Change 28 K Miles:
-New Spark Plugs - NGK Iridium's the ones with a 9 in the number, DCPR9EIX gapped to .028.
-Cleaned & Recharged K&N Air Filter -
-Put the stock muffler back on, which I have swapped a couple times now.
-TPS Reset had no impact.
-No CEL
Currently have it on a regulated battery charger and was going to make sure it charges, as well as going to check cables & connections all over the bike.

 

[buellbradski]

Did your problem start before or after your plug change? Reason I ask is I swapped to ngk dpr8es as ngk list and it ran crappy... Maybe due to my exhaust ,race ECM and other mods ?
What ECM do you have ?
Good luck

 

[user_deleted]

tbone: are your plug wires in good order..........and is the IAT switch connected? it is the switch attached to air box system base plate. sometimes the connector dislodges during routine maintenance.

 

[Tbone]

Thank You for the replies, sorry could not get back, had to work this last weekend.
Bike is totally stock. The only unstock item I have is a modified muffler that sometimes I put on the bike when I do a ride with my Harley friends.
Well I took a can of throttle body cleaner and put the spray tube in the IAC ports in the throat and it was quite dirty as black gunk poured out of them. My guess is that it came from the K&N filter oil, I must be re-charging it with too much oil? Now the bike will stay running and I actually rode it to work today.

The idle is still erratic and inconsistent. Will sometimes surge between 500 & 1400 rpms, then sometimes the idle is flat at 1800 to 2000 rpms, sometimes the idle is normal at about 1100 rpms. Sometimes it sputters when accelerating off idle. No CEL and everything seems the same. I will try a TPS reset on my lunch hour, as I tried it before cleaning out the throttle body, maybe another would help after a major cleaning?
This is the procedure for an 09 Uly right?
To reset an 08+ Buell, do the following:
1. Turn on the key.
2. Set the kill switch to the run position.
3. Don’t start the engine. Rotate the throttle from fully closed (gently forced closed) to fully
open (gently held open), and then back again to closed (gently forced closed).
4. Repeat 3 times. Hold each position (fully open, fully closed) for 1 full second.
5. Turn the key off and on.
6. If you connect to Directlink, a fully closed throttle should indicate 3.7 to 4.2 degrees. If it
doesn’t, repeat the above steps.

 

[06XB12SS_LOVER]

Have you checked your intake seals sound to me you have a intake leak with the high idle?

 

[Tbone]

Did the TPS reset and let it run for about 3 mins and it ran smooth at about 1200 rpm, assuming that is a normal cold idle. Hopefully it will be smooth all the way home from work.

With the air box off I sprayed outside the throttle body seals with sea foam with the motor running and it had no impact. Not sure that is a valid test or not? The manual says to use propane with some sort of trigger and hose set up. Afraid to burn my eye brows or worse.

 

[Tbone]

Ok, bike is running a little better and I am still commuting to work on it.
I notice an eradicately occuring hesitation and then the CEL flashes for a split of a second. It sometimes sputters when this happens and sometimes the CEL does not flash. Is it worth checking it for codes? I can't remember which pins I connected together to get the codes? I think it was the 1 and 5 oclock positions but I can't remember the orientation of the plug either? Sucks getting old and cannot remember details from a couple of months ago!

 

[Tbone]

Badweatherbikes has the full scoop on how to get the codes, it only took a few seconds of research with google. Sorry I should at least try to check it out before asking.

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=32777&post=514029#POST514029

 

[Tbone]

Ok I can read codes 44 and 14, Bank angle sensor and Air Temp respectively. I just pulled the air box off an removed the Air Temp sensor and plugged it back in.

Can the Bank angle sensor cause the engine to run erradic like this? is the bank angle sensor like a kill switch? Can I disconnect it and run the bike, at least temporarily?

 

[stamen]

the bank angle sensor is meant to kill fuel supply to your engine when the bike is leaned over (like in a crash) if the sensor is installed incorrectly the ecm will think that the bike is down and not upright, but at that point it wont even start. Check how its installed, if you dont know what it looks like google it.

spray the the Air temp sensor with electrical cleaner

 

[Tbone]

If the Bank angle sensor is toward the back of the seat behind the latch then it appears to be mounted ok.
If it is failing then it could be screwing with the fuel supply, causing it to flash the CEL and running eradic?

Thanks for the tip on the Air Temp sensor.

 

[stamen]

When you remove the air temp sensor check the pins in the connectors as well

 

[Tbone]

Not sure what to do next?
Sometimes, like every 4th traffic light or evern cold start, the Idle surges between 1000 to 1400 rpms, or runs flat at 1800 to 2000rpms. At least it is not stalling and I am still commuting to work on it.
Also it will sputter, CEL flashes on for about a second, then the bike sort of runs a little sluggish for a few seconds then back to normal. This happens about every 15 to 20 miles or so.
I have removed the BAS and it appears to be ok, I concluded this because the bike runs without it and when I rode w/o the bike behaved the same way. So the BAS is back on the bike.
Will next check the codes again after a few days of riding, see if there are new ones. It says the old ones stay in for 50 start ups, explains why I am seeing code 21 (EXV Act), as well as Air Temp, and BAS. I had disconnected the Air Box while cleaning the throttle body and ran the engine.

 

[steve92106]

I hate to stick my oar in when I know so little about bike maintenance but I had something similar about eight or nine months ago and had to replace the ECM. Do you have someone nearby who would swap with you for a short test? I'm in San Diego.

 

[Tbone]

I Hope this is solved, will find out tomorrow for sure. Instead of spraying carb or throttle body cleaner on the intake seals, I sprayed tri-flow teflon oil on them and the bike ran really well consistently for almost a whole tank about 150 miles. Then tightened the intake bolts with a 1/2 wrench, what a knuckle buster it is to get to them! Each bolt spun at least half a turn.
Is tightening them enough, do you need to use loctite, or anti-Seize or anything on these bolts? Do not think the seals need replacing, only 30K miles. Seals should be good for at least another 30K right? I probably will not take them out, at least without removing the motor.
I wanted to check the service manual for the torque on the bolts to make sure they are not over tight, not that I can get a torque wrench on them, but they are good and tight, 18 to 28ft lbs, as opposed to pretty darn tight, or very dam tight, super tight. I can't wait to put it back together and ride it.

 

[Tbone]

Still not solved. I just put a new set of intake seals on the bike last night. Same symptoms on the way into work. Did notice that the throttle body had a strip of black soot like from exhaust on the on the back left (primary side). I think since it is the opposite side of the headers it might be from the head gasket, or something worse.
A compression test should show if there is a head gasket leak or a crack right?

 

[SilveradoTX]

For what it's worth, you might try emailing the folks at EBR. I, and others, have contacted them before about different issues and questions.

Lay it all out for them and see what they reply with. It's at least worth a try.

 

[Tbone]

Thanks Silverado, Contacted Harley in Garland and they said to take it to Harley Dallas in Allen. So I will take it up there next week. They have some techs that own and work on their own Buells there.
I have been riding it everyday and will go to coffee and cars this weekend with my wife Kathy. The bike is still rideable.
Silverado do you happen to have an ECM Cable? Can you possibly reset the codes?

 

[hport7]

Tbone,

Have you checked your ECM for cracks?
The symtoms you have described are pointing to a bad ECM...

John

 

[Tbone]

Yep, thanks for all the input. Currently at Harley getting an ECM, intake seals, Rocker Gaskets. Hopefully will be done next week?