09 XB12R ECM problems. Please Help im loosing Hair!

[Slickit]

Hello Everyone,

I have been looking through this site and a few others reading all about ECMspy, Remapping, and the problems that come with all of it. I have recently installed a beautiful new D&D pipe on my bike and of course now I need to adjust the ECM for the changes. It is on my 2009 XB12R which I believe was made in April of that year. I have read posts saying that for this year and model you can not change the ECM with ECMspy and I have read other posts saying you can. I wanted to make this post so I can get an up-to-date decision on what exactly I can and can not do with ECMspy. Also...

My problem is this exactly:
I have ECMspy 1.12.1
the correct Interface cable.
stock and custom maps.
What I have been able to do is backup my stock EEPROM, View the live stats on the engine while it is running, check for error codes(?its lists none but check engine light is on?), But it will not let me burn a whole new fuel map or EEPROM. Whan I try to Burn a map or EEPROM if tries to get the firmware version but doesnt. It says "Failed to get firmware version... Exiting now". I know this is usually a simple issue like the key isnt on or switch isnt on run or incorrect driver installation. But I have gone through the driver installation process and done it a few times, even wiped the drivers and started over and yes the key and switch were in the right position. Im probably forgetting something though.
But anyway I just want my bike to run right and I dont have much money to buy any other programs or whole other ECM's right now. I was wondering if any of you out there in this vast sea of buell knowledge could help me with my little problem.
Thanks

 

[ich]

ecmspy for windows does not support models 2008+.

 

[taylor]

your out of luck. You can either do tune boy or direct link which may or may not work. Or you can buy a new "plug and play" ECU from erikbuellracing.com which will work better then stock but not perfect. I have one on mine and it gets rid of all the decel pop and makes it run a bit better.

 

[dallasb]

Tune boy? Do you mean tunerpro?

 

[Sirius815]

There's a thread about tuning 08+ bikes here on Buellxb. It's a pretty decent walk through, but you'll probably want to read it about 4-5 times. I'll try and find it again and I'll post the link up for you.

EDIT: Here you go: http://www.buellxb.com/Buell-XB-For...Mods/Flashing-a-Race-Map-to-ALL-Buells-08-too

It's about putting a race map on, but I should get you started never-the-less.

 

[dallasb]

I really don't understand why someone would want to put a race map onto a stock ecm. Why not just do a datalog so that the ecm is tuned for YOUR bike...not one that was on a dyno at the Buell facility. The only values I have to my ecm that came directly from the race map are the low end fuel value (you can't get those very easily with data logging) and some of the timing values. You will have a much better running bike if you take the time to learn how to a custom tune.

 

[Sirius815]

True, however if you don't have the time to do such - as was my case, the race map is a good alternative (notice I didn't say the best). I was able to take the bike for a decent ride before I had to put it away for storage, however I had the feeling that the tune (especially down load) was better than the stock.

That being said, I will be datalogging when I get back, but then I still have to find the time to do such as I have other projects that I'm still waiting to take care of as well.

 

[ich]

the race map is a good alternative (notice I didn't say the best).

why is there a need for an alternative?
in which parts is the stock map wrong?
how did you prove it?

 

[Slickit]

I recently put a D&D pipe on the bike and that makes the bike run lean. And the Race ECM isnt going to make much of a difference since I still am not using a stock or race pipe. But I talked to a person in the service department of my local HD dealer (they are actually great about their buells) and they said that the 09's should actually tune them selves pretty well since they have a different ECM than the others. So for now I am going to ride it and let the ECM adjust for a while then take it in and get some dyno info from it to make sure it will make it for the long haul. Wish me luck.

 

[ich]

I recently put a D&D pipe on the bike and that makes the bike run lean.

this is wrong and if you had checked, you would know. but you chose not to. ddfi equipped buells don't run lean, as the ecm prevents them from running lean. in closed loop: mixture is monitored and adjusted to stoich anyway. in open loop: mixture is monitored and adjusted when lean for longer than 3 seconds (typically). your hd dealer has no clue how ddfi works.

 

[anrkizm95]

i have an 09 with a d&d the pipe will make it run lean.adding a high flow filter makes it even worse.i recomend useing the ebr ecm for the jardine pipe.the ebr ecm made a hugh difference.this is from asb exhaust shoot out/It is important to understand that ALL of the data collected and displayed in this report is Wide Open
Throttle (WOT) data only. The frequency response (RPM) of the pipe is well characterized by this type
of testing. But the Fueling curves that are shown represent ONLY the WOT response. Since the FI maps
in the ECM are different for each throttle setting, the fueling matches displayed may not be typical of
the fueling response at other throttle settings. The Buell ECM compensating mechanism (AFV scaling)
is only capable of scaling the entire fueling curve up or down. It is not capable of flattening peaks and
raising valleys in the fueling curves. Based on the fueling responses we saw during this testing, I would
be very hesitant to run a stock ECM on ANY bike equipped with these exhaust systems. In some cases,
the Race ECM provides a decent match to the fueling needs. But in most, a remapping of the ECM
would be the best way to assure that the fueling is neither too rich, or worse yet, too lean.asb

 

[ich]

buells don't run lean. neither in closed loop nor in open loop. mixture is monitored as long as lambda sensor feedback is not disabled. for perfect performance a remap might be appropriate, but not to fix a lean situation that does not exist.

 

[Sirius815]

Quote:
the race map is a good alternative (notice I didn't say the best).


why is there a need for an alternative?
in which parts is the stock map wrong?
how did you prove it?

I've got an '05 so I don't have the DDFI ecm, so I can't speak from first hand experience on the ddfi ecm. However - the stock map, coupled with K&N filter, de-snorkel, and Spec-ops pipe, had some chugging in lower RPMs where I tend to ride most (between 1800-2500). The speed limits on post are low so there's no need to rev to 5k just to get to 25MPH, not to mention that my ride is only 2 miles, so the motor doesn't even get 100% hot during the cold months.

The race map definitely improved the rpm range where I spend most of my time and "feels" better up too, although there is no real proof for the top end. The bottom end can definitely be felt.

I can only speculate that the 08-10 ecms have the same sort of tune as the 03-07s and that with modifications, a race map may be better than the stock - and of course datalogging would be best.

 

[anrkizm95]

buells do run lean.they are lean from the factory due to epa mandates.if you get a chance to put it on a dyno you will see.

 

[dallasb]

I've got an '05 so I don't have the DDFI ecm,

FYI you do have DDFI. 03-07 have DDFI2 while 08+ have DDFI3.

Buells can and will run lean if you modify your pipe and intake. Sometimes on the DDFI3 bikes you can get away when you just add one of the two mods listed above. Ich put your ecm back to stock and put a pipe and filter on your bike. Go for a data ride and I guarantee that there will be areas of the bike that will be lean. The reason for this is the 02 sensor adjusts the entire fuel curve...not just sections of it. So if it adjusts fuel value for 4500 rpm, that does not necessarily mean that the same scale should be applied at 6000. Will it run? Yes. Will it most likely not harm your motor? Yes (assuming you ONLY did a pipe and filter, no headers or open airbox).

 

[ich]

buells do run lean.they are lean from the factory due to epa mandates.

prove it.

if you get a chance to put it on a dyno you will see.

been there, done that. probably more often than you had a warm lunch.

lean means less then 90% of fuel for a stoich condition (afr > 16.2).

all buells run stoich in closed loop, regardless which muffler or air filter. no buell buell will run rich or lean in closed loop, because stoich is the only condition that can be maintained successfully with a narrowband sensor.

all buells run rich on wot. no buell is mapped lean at wot. even if by accident the engine would run lean (sensor failure etc.), this is corrected by open loop learn within seconds.

 

[shopking68]

this is good info. popcorn.gif

 

[anrkizm95]

Dont need to prove anything.mines right just keep doing what your doing more power to ya.

 

[Sirius815]

FYI you do have DDFI. 03-07 have DDFI2 while 08+ have DDFI3.

Doh! Where's my head at - I knew that. Thanks!

 

[jimijeans]

Make sure you re-set TPS on your bike after the exhaust install. After that, ride on a known area daylite only.Train your electronics(ECM)to the change you made, every time. You can get by w/ small changes such as Exhaust/Freeflowing air filter, if you haven't worked w/ecm spy BE careful most times i see a lot of damage due to hastyness! On 08+ the developers in research have made some good changes. You can re-set your TPS W/ a simple key turn & 3 throttle turns. Please look that up before you try it. AS far as Ecm Spy you need the drivers 1st., then the Windows 7 for a better job. Once you get that its not bad to work with. Always (save or burn your) stock Epromm before doing anything so you have a backup . Easy way i tell most that come over to my shop is Erik Buell Racings Ecm. Its ready to go! Make sure you tell them the exhaust thats on your XB.! Good Luck.