Motorcycle helmet laws!!!

[ReconLdr]

I believe in individual liberty. As a man "I" alone am responsible for my safety. If I want to ride my bike in rush hour traffic wearing nothing more a ball cap, thong and flip flops, I should be allowed to do so. If I want to ingest, inhale or inject any substance into my body, it is my business.

The concepts of freedom and liberty are so far gone from our society, that when shit like this gets "repealled" some people get themselves into a frenzy. How sad is it when a state "gives" back freedom, that it makes such a huge news event. In reality, when the Helmet laws were proposed, the people should have fought it harder.

I personally don't ride without a helmet (sometimes wear a 1/2 helmet though). I tried it once and it just felt "wrong" and haven't done it since. I do notice I ride much more aggressively the more gear I have on. When I'm just puttering around taking in the sights, I like wearing my 1/2 helmet, if I am commuting to work and fighting my way through traffic, I wear full gear.

 

[Junkbone]

I wear one and will continue to do so if our State passes the no helmet law, but with that said I don't see how any of you could support a law that takes away our freedom of choice. I had a friend die from a head injury on a motorcycle. It was his choice. It sucks but still..my life my choice. Insurance debate? So what? We allow them to basicly make up the rates on a whim anyway, once our States made insurance mandantory.

 

[konarider94]

Theres always the other side of why riders feel they do not need to wear the helmet. Why do you think some feel they do not need their helmets?

Why do they need a reason? People should be able to choose one way or another. Choosing to not wear a helmet does not endanger anyone else. The choice has no impact on others rights. Whereas in a car it can be argued that someone without a seatbelt can be a danger to other passengers in the vehicle.

 

[snrusnak]

Whereas in a car it can be argued that someone without a seatbelt can be a danger to other passengers in the vehicle.

Can you elaborate on this?

I agree, people should be able to do whatever they want as long as it doesn't effect others. And like I said above my only issue is when they have to be cleaned up off the street then that is effecting others. It may not seem like it but it really scars you emotionally to see that/deal with that.

 

[ReconLdr]

I agree, people should be able to do whatever they want as long as it doesn't effect others. And like I said above my only issue is when they have to be cleaned up off the street then that is effecting others. It may not seem like it but it really scars you emotionally to see that/deal with that.

So are you implying that when people wear helmets, they never have to be cleaned up off the streets? Riding with a helmet doesn't prevents accidents, it only makes some (latest stats I saw stated 67%) of them survivable.

Be careful using this as your argument ^^^^. By this line of thinking Motorcycles should be banned. Since scraping people off the street helmet or not effects others too. This is the same line of thinking the insurance companies used to convince politicians to require helmets in the first place.

 

[snrusnak]

^No that's not it. The problem is human heads have a tendency to explode when hitting pavement at high speeds.

 

[snrusnak]

And just to be clear, I'm not advocating it should be law to have to wear a helmet, I'm just saying that this is my only issue with people choosing not to wear helmets(and other gear for that matter).

 

[Junkbone]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLBHymzs0hU

^No that's not it. The problem is human heads have a tendency to explode when hitting pavement at high speeds

And sometimes worse WITH a helmet. Warning. Bad crash.

 

[ReconLdr]

^No that's not it. The problem is human heads have a tendency to explode when hitting pavement at high speeds.

But arms and legs don't???? Bodies don't get mangled, in a crash??? If your head hits the pavement hard enough even while wearing a helmet, your head will still explode... the helmet or other gear just contains the mess.

I'm not trying to get into a pissing contest with you, I'm simply countering your argument (playing devils advocate).

Note: I support helmet use, I'm against helmet laws.

 

[konarider94]

Can you elaborate on this?

I agree, people should be able to do whatever they want as long as it doesn't effect others.  And like I said above my only issue is when they have to be cleaned up off the street then that is effecting others.  It may not seem like it but it really scars you emotionally to see that/deal with that.

a car passenger not wearing a seatbelt becomes a projectile in a crash and will injure/kill someone else that is buckled in the same vehicle.

and yes when someone dies it does affect people but it does not violate any of their rights. everything you do affects someones feelings in some way but it does not cause harm. and what recon said, people in my own family already are not happy that i choose to ride a motorcycle in the first place.

 

[firefighter1c57]

The military uses risk assessment forms to determine risk levels for everything we do, and use controls to reduce those risk. There is a risk in everything. What is a acceptable risk level to one person may not be acceptable to another. I'll give a example.
To me, I will not ride with a textile or mesh jacket. I'll only ride with a leather jacket. You will not find a racing association in the U.S. that allows textile suits, and you'll find very few tracks that will allow on for MLDs. To me, textile is to risky.
Now, do I think that means that EVERYONE should wear leather every time they ride? No.

Certain actions are more risky than others, riding a motorcycle period is one of those. However, it is not the states place to enforce a risk level on people. People have the right to chose to do stupid things, and yes, in some instances things that will kill their dumbasses.

I've worked a lot of car wrecks where people died because they were not wearing a seat belt, and I don't think there should be a seat belt law. I've worked motorcycle wrecks were people would have probably lived had they been wearing a helmet, and I don't think there should be a helmet law.

In states were such laws exist, you end up with the vast majority of "cruiser" riders wearing "novelty" helmets. IE, not DOT helmets, plastic helmets, or chrome helmets, or retarded helmets with horns on them. It does nothing to actually promote brain protection, but it does "meet" the law.

As such, they provide a limited amount of protection. Here's a research paper for the University of Nebraska on such laws. You'll find states with helmet laws actually had a higher death rate.

From 1994 to 1996, states with helmet laws experienced a median death rate of 6.20 riders
per 10 000 registered motorcycles and states without helmet laws experienced a median death rate of 5.07 riders per 10 000
registered motorcycles

 

[firefighter1c57]

All that said, I ALWAYS wear a helmet and I always recommend others do as well.


Besides, it's a DoD regulation.

 

[firefighter1c57]

Whereas in a car it can be argued that someone without a seatbelt can be a danger to other passengers in the vehicle.

Can you elaborate on this?

I can. If a rear seat passenger is not wearing a seat belt, and a front seat passenger/driver is, the rear seat passenger in a frontal vehicle collision is thrown up over the front seats breaking the neck of the front passengers in the vehicle. Seen it.

 

[snrusnak]

Well a head on collision at a combined speed of probably over 100mph isn't really what I had in mind, I think no matter what in that situation it'd be a graphic scene.

My whole point is that under a normal or common accident like say someone running you out of your lane or off the road or something like that(because honestly motorcycles accidents are pretty common considering many ride dangerously and most cagers don't pay attention to us) having a helmet and gear means the difference between a person living or a cleanup crew pickup up the pieces of that person.

This is just what I feel from the accidents I've seen with vs without gear.

 

[snrusnak]

It's just my personal feelings on the topic. I don't think anyone should be forced to wear a helmet or gear, I just don't want to have to clean that person up...

 

[firefighter1c57]

not necessarily a head on collision. I said frontal collision, IE, striking a fixed object like a tree, or T-boning another vehicle. Head on collisions with combined speeds exceeding 100+ are usually fatal for one vehicle or another despite safety equipment.

 

[snrusnak]

firefigher that wasn't directed at you, I was posting that in reply to the video of the motorcycle hitting the truck.

I can understand the seat belt thing, just had never thought about that I guess.

 

[jasonxb9]

If you're adamant that you are going to wear a helmet all the time then what does it matter if it's law? I understand the right to choose, but here in Canada our medical premiums go up when people get injured or sick at a high rate, so if there were no helmet laws here it would cost us way more money due to stupidity!!! So I am all for helmet laws, they keep the rest of us from paying for dumbass people making dumbass "choices"

 

[burgandy25]

Here in MI the day after the no helmet law was passed I saw a guy wearing cargo shorts and a t-shirt riding his gixxer with his helmet on his helmet lock. Personally its stupid anyone would ride without one but they beleived it stopped tourist from Ohio and Illinois from coming to MI because they had to wear a helmet. Well hey don't let them wear a helmet, Darwins theory, we don't need their genes in our gene pool.

 

[icecoldcoasty]

AS AN EMT WHO HAS SEEN HIS FIAR SHARE OF MOTORCYCLE ACCIDENTS. HELMETS SAVE LIVES FACT. BUT THEY ONLY DO IT AT GENERALY SLOW SPEEDS AND ONLY PREVENT HEAD INJURIES. A HELMET DOES NOTHING WHEN YOU T BONE A CAR AT 50 ACCEPT GIVE YOU AN OPEN CASKET. I COME FROM A STATE THAT HAS NO HELMET LAW (OHIO) AND THERE ARE SO MANY FATALITIES DUE TO NOT WEARING A HELMET. THEY ARE AND INTEGRAL PART OF YOUR RIDING EQIPTMENT. IF THE ACCIDENT IS ENOUGH TO DESTROY YOUR INTERNALS THEN THE HELMET WILL PROTECT YOUR HEAD BUT WHAT GOOD IS A FACE IF THE BODY DONT WORK. JUST MY 2 CENTS. REMEMBER PEOPLE YOU CAN BE THE BEST RIDER EVER BUT THERE ARE 3 BILLION PEOPLE OUT THERE IN CARS TRYING TO KILL YOU.