Any supermoto fans on here? Looking for advice.

[VT2MA]

Hey all,
I just got a job offer and will start work in January. Now that I know I will be making some money I think I need a winter project. I really want to build a supermoto for banshin around the city and hitting some trails back in VT. I love my Buell for the VT roads, but she's just getting beat to crap on these sh*tty Worcester, MA roads. I'm technically still a full time student at my school so I have pretty unlimited access to a full machine and manual shop (I go to WPI). I pretty much want to mock up a bike with old/cheap dirt parts, but over time replace them all with parts that I've made myself. So to start I need to choose an engine, I found a few old bikes on craigslist. First question is 2 or 4 stroke? I really want light weight and over powered so I'm leaning towards 2-stroke. I will be registering it in VT so no real emission laws and I can register a 2-stroke for road use. If I do go 2-stroke what engine size do you think I should be looking for? I found an 1985 ktm 250 for 800 bucks, but it only has around 17 hp. There's also a 1987 kx500 (2-stroke) for 600 bucks and that baby has 65hp. Am I dreaming thinking I'll be able to keep an 85-87 2-stroke running/be able to find parts? If people really think I should go with a 4-stroke, what engine size should I look for? I want gobs of power that I would be able to go on/off road.
Thanks in advance!
George

edit: the 87 ktm 250 is an exc so it has a setup for road use already.. not sure about the kx500

 

[BuellerPilot]

Take some advice from a turd polisher extrordanaire (me). I've done way too many projects (or should I say started way too many) starting with older beat up junk to save a buck to kick projects off. In the end if you buy a bike from the 80's you'll be kicking yourself for several reasons. One and formost is finding replacement parts. Second is you won't be using any other parts from the bike at all because they are so dated. Your going to want a nice set of up side down forks, not use those old school steel double shock little travel swing arm etc. Double your initial budget and buy something that has more usable parts like forks, mono shock rear, aluminum perimeter frame etc. You'll be happier that you did, the bike will be more modern not only looking, but performance as well. Then work on making custom bits for it, like machined triple clamps, billet subframes, billet lower stays, billet engine cases, custom body, tank, seats etc. It'll be actually cheaper in the end and have better performance (lighter, more power) and you'll still be able to get replacement and or performance enhancing parts.

As for 2 or 4 stroke. The 2 stroke bikes make gobs of power, even in the low end if it's fairly modern and large enough. There's not much too go wrong with a two stroke and it's easy to hop them up. All you need to freshen a dinger is a piston, set of rings and honing the cyclinder (can be done with a proper bit and hand drill). Hop it up is easy too, there's over sized pistons and stroker kits, reed valves and better carbs. Now if you go with a modern dirt bike 4 stroke..... If it's tired and has some hours it's going to be pricey and labor intensive to freshen it up. Valve seats and valves tend to be the first thing to go on those things because they use titanium valves and they eat seats and gall up. The parts are expansive and so is the machine work required. They make gobs of torque and sound cool though and release less emissions. They are harder to easily extract more powr from them because they are all ready hot rodded from the factory and most performance mods make them peaky in their power bands except bore and stroking.
~Mike.......

 

[BuellerPilot]

If your patient and diligent with your searching, you can find dirt bikes that are only a few years old for around $1k. Craigslist and your local paper and hanging around local dirt bike tracks is your best bet. I search for my Buell for a couple months ( actually a couple years, but searched seriously for a couple months) and bought a 2006 with 2100 miles on it for $2800. My Nephew just got 2005 YZ250 for $900. Infact his dad is selling a Suzuki DRZ400 witch is a street legal dirt bike. Those actually could be bought with a factory Motard Version, but his is the standard streetable dirtbike. We live in Virginia if you were interested. I'm not sure of the year or mileage. THOSE bikes had bullet proof engines that are trouble free (no valve issues because their not titanium). Tons of hop up parts (Same engine as the quads). sorry, didn't mean to post this as a plug, it litterally popped in my head as I was respoding about doing bike searches.

~Mike.....

 

[Trill]

I love 2 stroke bikes but for supermoto street use I think a modern 450f would be your best choice but will cost you more but has the gobs of power you are looking for.. no oil to stink you up if you want to ride to work. I have never owned a supermoto or even ridden one but I dream of getting one sometime soon. I passed on a ktm 525sm for 2500 a few months ago because I didnt have the cash.

I think if you can find an older yz426f and throw some supermoto wheels on it you would be a happy camper

Also look up Gbalias on here or buelletinboard.com he races supermoto.

Forgot to mention thumpertalk.com is a great site and tons of knowledge to help you out!~

Good luck !

 

[VT2MA]

All really sound advice. I've been a member of ThumperTalk for a while now. I think I'm goin to wait and see if I can get a late 90's 250 2t or >400 4t for a good price.

 

[bttrfngrz]

i agree with bueller pilot, old **** sucks. keep your ear to craigslist

 

[VT2MA]

Keeping my eye out, but I just go this email;

84 Honda CR500, 86 Yamaha TT600 (4 stroke), 87 Yamaha XT550 (4 stroke). These bikes have all been hanging around for too long. All are complete and all ran when put away last. All turn over and I'm sure with a little tlc will run fine. XT has a corroded steel fuel tank. I plan to spend some time later this winter to make them all run so as to unload them in the spring. $800, $700,, $700. David C. I'm usually around if you have any interest in looking at them.

Any reason any of those would be irresistible?

 

[Trill]

If you don't pick that cr500 up you will regret it.. you should check ebay for the prices that the ENGINE ALONE sells for. You can get a brand new cr500 in a modern frame these days but ur looking at close to 10k for it. Google Service Honda

If you have the cash save that cr500 from becoming a rust bucket!!!

 

[VT2MA]

Just found a crf450x for $1350. Its got a new jug, head, piston and rings, new top end gastket kit. it just needs the top end put back together. If I can get to it before he sells it I think I will buy it.

 

[Thaloc]

DRZ400 all the way. Im moving to sumo next season, and have been comparing everything I could. For what it costs its better the get a modern bike set up for the street. And like BuellPilot said, their engines are bullet proof.

I was really torn between the DRZ400sm and the WR250X

 

[TooFst]

Just an FYI. You want to put on wider forks/ triple clams to run a super-motard front wheel. Not cheap.


I've wanted to get a motard bike for awhile but decided to go strictly dirt just because of the front end cost. I'm my opinion dual sport or enduo is the way to go.
Oh yea, plus one on the Drz's and cr500's

 

[raven]

had a 625KTM SMC before I got the Buell,great street bike.If you go with a KTM get their hard parts book, they have more stuff than you can shake a chequebook at,have fun with the build

 

[chevnut55]

on/off road bikes are the moast fun you can have on 2 wheels,you can ride on the street and use things like curbs and speed bumps for jumps,then if you find a trail just take it and see where you come out and ride home.
i have a klxr 400 its the dirt version of the klxs and the same as the drx 400 except the drz and s are street ready and are heavier with a steel tank,smaller carb,etc. the conversion kit was cheap and a vapor computer is all you need for gauges.
the only thing i wish about my klxr is that it was made by buell,sao this winter its getting black plasticks and a street fighter headlight that has the buell look.
i have super moto wheels that were expencive but i only used them for 100 miles,stick with the dirt wheels they work fine on the street..the highway not so much.
i looked at a few 2 stroke bikes before i bought mine and i decided on a 4 stroke because it has pleany of power,last forever,no mixing oil/gas,electric start,much more usable on the street.
if your set on building your own creation and want it a 2 cycle ,use a banchee motor 2 screaming pistons ,i had one and was thinking how cool it would be on a street bike ,it would want to flip backwards at 70-80 on the street! but it was a headake maintaing the motor..it was a time bomb.
check out thumper talk ,its a good site with a lot of info. any 400cc and up 4 stroke dirt bike will be a fun streetbike. but 5 us us have drz 400/klx 400 for the last few years and no problems yet,they are great bikes on and off the road. just dont expect the bike to be the best at either ,just good at bolth.

 

[MotoPhreke]

The DRZ400 can make a great low budget super moto, and can do just about anything. If you get an S model, you'll have to make some upgrades to get the most out of it like the carb and some suspension upgrades. If you get the dirt model you'll have to find a way to make it road legal, but that could be easier in VT than in MA or CT.
I agree completely with chevnut55 in that Thumpertalk is the place to go for DRZ info.

 

[black_xb12r]

i runs tons of supermoto.... if ur gonan run street you want a 4 stroke... and if u do highway nto just in town you want at LEAST a 450... if u want gobs of power ull want a ktm 625smc or smr or a ktm 690...

 

[GatorBuell]

My last bike before the Buell was a DRZ400SM. I loved that bike but stopping for gas every 80 miles and riding on what felt like a 2x4 got to me. Running around town was fun but a 2+ hour ride would ware me out.

 

[VT2MA]

Well the crf450 is too far away for me to get at the moment.. You talked me into searching for a drz400.

 

[chevnut55]

get a drz or a klx,they are the same bike. my brother got the drz s i got the klx r. he had to remove and upgrade alot of things to make it as good looking and as fast as mine,i had to do a bit to make it street legal and street worthy..theres a difference.also mine cost a lot more than his..and his came with a title.
we swith bikes and we bolth fell mine is a much better dirt bike and his a better street bike. mine came with a bigger carb,better suspension,its lighter,different subframe w/o rear pegs so no passengers,its stronger,geared different.
but mine sucks on the highway it will do 100 on the dirt but the highway it is not fun holding it at 60 mph,the drz it a bit better there.
if you are doing mostly street riding go with the s if you play on/off road and no highways and want to go faster go with the r.
if you have any questions just ask and ill tell you what you need and how to do it.

 

[kalifornia]

As someone regularly trying to keep up with bad ass sm riders I agree with black xb 100%. My vote HUSKY 510.

 

[delta one]

damn that is a hot looking bolt!

but on topic
a 400 2stroke with an expansion chamber pipe on it is a monstrosity
WAY more power than I could ever use so hang on tight, like black_xb12r said it may not be any fun on the street though

I think a 4stroke would be a little more civil on the street but no fun on the highway, I say go 450 and just know that if you are running a lot of highway that day take the buell instead.

just my .02

I would love a husky or KTM sumo to tear it up on around town and hit the moderate trails at times too, I'm just too broke