Rocker box gasket service

[Mesozoic]

After my latest round of full throttle tuning, my rear rocker box (most likely just the PCV grommet) is leaking enough for oil to make its way down to the primary cover. So I bought the gaskets and grommets needed to do a whole rocker box gasket/grommet service on both cylinders and have started tearing the bike down. My concern is with engine rotation because I don't think I've ever needed to do it before - or my memory is failing me and I just don't remember what I did a very long time ago.

I need to rotate the engine significantly in order to clear the frame and rear valve cover. It doesn't seem like that's going to be possible with a simple rotation down. I was considering remove the engine entirely from the bike, but am also kind of lazy and would like to avoid unnecessary dismantling for a mere gasket repair. I've started thinking about using my engine hoist to strap the frame up and lift it over the engine instead? I've got a rear stand supporting the bike via some axle sliders, not sure that's enough for stabilization, but I've always been a bit dangerous. :black_eyed:

Anyway, looking for opinions... not really sure what to do here. Bike's been on "jackstands" for the last month or more and would like to get it back on the road again. :up:

Happy belated US Thanksgiving.

 

[RidetheLightning]

34:19 should be able to weigh in here, but I know he's all for lifting the frame off the motor vs. just a rotation. I've gotta say, after my first rotation last month, I was surprised at how tight the access still is. Given it was my first time, I wasn't feeling up for completely dropping the motor out, but I think the extra time to do it could more than offset the time spent goofing around trying to get in through the top of the frame.

 

[BuellyBagger]

I never thought it was terrible working between the frame on the rear cylinder. I mean it's a little fiddly, but nothing out of the ordinary considering what I deal with working on cars for a living. I will say though 34:19 swears by the frame removal procedure and I'm sure it does allow much better access to the motor.

 

[Mesozoic]

What's the opinion on using the crane to lift the frame up and away from the engine while it's supported and still attached to the rear mount (so it can rotate)?

 

[RidetheLightning]

What's the opinion on using the crane to lift the frame up and away from the engine while it's supported and still attached to the rear mount (so it can rotate)?

I'm not sure I follow. The crane sounds smart for lifting off the frame when fully disconnected, but I don't see how it helps in a rotation. When I did my rotation I left the lift under the engine without fully locking off the valve and it slowly lowered down to the point where the engine was touching the front tire by the time I came back outside. Are oyu removing the wheel and trying to lift the frame further to get the front cylinder completely on it's side?

 

[Mesozoic]

I'm not sure I follow. The crane sounds smart for lifting off the frame when fully disconnected, but I don't see how it helps in a rotation. When I did my rotation I left the lift under the engine without fully locking off the valve and it slowly lowered down to the point where the engine was touching the front tire by the time I came back outside. Are oyu removing the wheel and trying to lift the frame further to get the front cylinder completely on it's side?

Yes, I was planning to remove the front wheel and completely expose the top of the rear cylinder for unfettered access to it, but now planning to do both cylinders at the same time.

 

[34nineteen]

After my latest round of full throttle tuning, my rear rocker box (most likely just the PCV grommet) is leaking enough for oil to make its way down to the primary cover.

Why not just replace the grommet? Its not that hard to do even with the engine in place.

I wasn't feeling up for completely dropping the motor out, but I think the extra time to do it could more than offset the time spent goofing around trying to get in through the top of the frame.

My feelings exactly, but for a single rocker box, if you just want to get it done as quickly as possible, a rotate should be OK. I like to do a thorough cleaning and replace more of the hard to get at gaskets and seals so I appreciate the access provided by removing the frame completely.

To remove the frame its only about 5 more steps from a rotation, and you really need a secure area to do this job as you will have motorcycle parts everywhere for awhile. Some peoples work area situations may make the rotate much more palatable than a removal.

Also, the rotate requires being able to drop (rotate) the front of the engine downwards. I like to use a regular ATV style platform jack which makes the rotate part a little tricky, but provides a stable base to hold the motor and swingarm in place when pulling the frame off.

What's the opinion on using the crane to lift the frame up and away from the engine

If you want to, sure....



But I think this is much easier. Its even easier with the forks and front wheel in place as that can carry the some of the weight of the assembly.

 

[Cooter]

#1 Ignore it. It's not a race bike that gets ridden that way so it won't leak that bad normally riding. Wipe it off before you cars n' coffee run, and enjoy a working motorcycle.
#2 Just replace that one weeping grommet in 10 seconds, and put it back together, so you can get to cars n' coffee, and enjoy a working motorcycle.
#3 I use a paddock stand on the swingarm, ratchet straps from the rafters to the pillion peg mounts, the front wheel chocked, and an automotive found-in-the-trunk scissor jack to lower the engine. It allows the engine to rotate easier but is less stable than an ATV jack. It might get back together by March. Might. (See 34:19's garage).
#4 It does make sense to remove the last 4 bolts and remove the engine, find any other possible issues and proceed accordingly with parts and repairs, maybe forever. (See the other side of 34:19's garage). But wait, aren/t we just talking about a seeping grommet? See #1, maybe #2 IMO.

Summers coming! Tick tock!

 

[Mesozoic]

Thanks all. The leak has created quite a mess, so I really need to "get in there" in order to clean it up. If the rear cylinder can be fully exposed through rotation then I'm probably fine, but I didn't think that would be the case.

I do have the space to dismantle everything and leave it that way for a while. I finally completed my shop, so I've got the bike in a corner where it can live for a long time. My 1125CR is back on the road, so I'm still on 2-wheels as well, otherwise this would've been far more urgent!

 

[34nineteen]

If the rear cylinder can be fully exposed through rotation then I'm probably fine, but I didn't think that would be the case.

Are you replacing the PCV grommet or the rocker box cover gasket? Even if you are replacing the rocker box gasket, you do not need to unbolt the head or remove the cylinder.

 

[RidetheLightning]

His first post said rear rocker is leaking. Honestly, it depends on your room and how quickly you want to ride. I had high hopes of replacing all sorts of stuff, but I was working in a carport with limited hours, so I opted to just rotate and replace what was leaking, nothing more. Rotation isn't that difficult, space is pretty tight, but PCV was by far easiest part of the process. Just my 0.02.

 

[34nineteen]

His first post said rear rocker is leaking. Honestly, it depends on your room and how quickly you want to ride. I had high hopes of replacing all sorts of stuff, but I was working in a carport with limited hours, so I opted to just rotate and replace what was leaking, nothing more. Rotation isn't that difficult, space is pretty tight, but PCV was by far easiest part of the process. Just my 0.02.

I think you would likely agree that determing whether its really the rocker box gasket or the PCV grommet is going to be paramount to whether the job takes 15 minutes or 6 hours.

How much time do you think you had into your rotate? 3 hours each way?

 

[Mesozoic]

It sounds like a rotation will do it, I will see. I'm going in to replace all of the top end gaskets and seals, including the PCV grommet and the rocker box seal. I was also thinking about replacing the intake seals, but I can't figure out what parts I actually need for that job.

 

[RidetheLightning]

I think you would likely agree that determing whether its really the rocker box gasket or the PCV grommet is going to be paramount to whether the job takes 15 minutes or 6 hours.

How much time do you think you had into your rotate? 3 hours each way?

probably 3-4 hours, going verrry slowly, to rotate down. More like 1-2 to get it back together. And yes, PCV would be an extremely quick job.

 

[RidetheLightning]

It sounds like a rotation will do it, I will see. I'm going in to replace all of the top end gaskets and seals, including the PCV grommet and the rocker box seal. I was also thinking about replacing the intake seals, but I can't figure out what parts I actually need for that job.

Not trying to be a jerk here, but the part for the intake seal is the intake seal(s). If you google buellxb intake seal you will find all sorts of info. Some people swear by the james intake seals with the lip, others say those are too much of a pain to get to fit right and to just use OEM.

 

[Mesozoic]

Not trying to be a jerk here, but the part for the intake seal is the intake seal(s). If you google buellxb intake seal you will find all sorts of info. Some people swear by the james intake seals with the lip, others say those are too much of a pain to get to fit right and to just use OEM.

LOL I think where I became confused was when I started looking at the James catalog comparing it to the St. Paul HD online catalog. Wasn't clear if there was a variation between years of the engines (2003-2007 vs 2008-2010) and then I also discovered that I might need a special tool for installation. I basically realized that it was a bit more of a PITA than I was hoping for... and gave up.

 

[Mesozoic]

I finally got the bastard rotated down using a combination of engine hoist with straps, transmission jack adapter on a floor jack and the Pitbull rear stand. Unfortunately, my throttle cables are damaged - the metal housing is completely worn down exposing the inner cable. I think the correct part for my '08 XB12Ss is N0307.5AC and N0308.5AC, but I don't see any of those in stock anywhere. I do see that St. Paul's HD has N0308.5AA and N0307.5AA, but they are supposedly for the XB12R?

 

[Cooter]

I have some brand new ones still sealed in the HD bag, let me see what number they are.

 

[Barrett]

Nothing special or specific about a Ss cable set.

N0307.5AC is the puller cable for all S models---stock bars---excess of 25 still in system.
N0308.5AC is pusher/return cable---clean/lube/re-use if possible as nothing more than a bull**** safety cable.

AA series for Firebolt only.

 

[Mesozoic]

Nothing special or specific about a Ss cable set.

N0307.5AC is the puller cable for all S models---stock bars---excess of 25 still in system.
N0308.5AC is pusher/return cable---clean/lube/re-use if possible as nothing more than a bull**** safety cable.

AA series for Firebolt only.

Thanks for confirming. The pusher/return cable is completely destroyed for some reason. This is the 1st engine rotation I've ever done myself (I think), but I've had the HD dealership perform several warranty repairs back in the day. The only place I'm seeing stock for the cables is on Twin Motorcycles out of the Netherlands. I'm happy to order from there, but was thinking it might be more expeditious to find parts in the USA.