Harley Davidson Strategy. As I see it.

[wokor2wheel]

Ghost it is obvious that you are not in sales. Out of the Four bikes that you have listed as great bikes only two of those bikes sell
(Street Glide,Nightster) the other two sit and collect dust (Rocker-C, Night Rod). You also pointed out that there is alot of fluff in the list. I see alot of Fat and Not Boy or Bob. We as a dealer have to look at what sells and what doesn't. We can't have bikes that just sit around and not get sold. We have to many already. Your in S. Cali...that explains it to much sun. or bud. You honestly think that Harley wanted Buell to fail?? Man you are F$%^ up. GM didn't want Pontiac, Hummer etc.. to fail.but they have so accept it.

 

[XBear9S]

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/10/20/buell-will-be-back-county-officials-throwing-axed-hd-brand-a-li/

Special K!
Central Texas Hill Country HellBuellies
"I'm a HellBuelly! What the hell are you?"

"Sans la Buell la Vie serait une Erreur"
"Without Buell, life would be a serious mistake."

- Frederich Bueller Nietzsche

 

[ghost96b69]

Your GD right I'm not in sales, I would never rely on someone walking in the door randomly to pay my salary. I'm an Engineer - and yes, Harley did want Buell to fail. The put em' out there half heartedly because they bought the company but they didn't push the product and they certainly didn't offer anything to try to make people Want the Buell bikes. The Rocker C & Nightrod, nor the Nightster sit & collect dust around here. The Rocker C has to be special ordered and there are NONE on e-bay. Like I said, the bikes you see the most of in the Used market are the one's people buy and then realize they don't want. Like the Sportster. When I was in the market for a Harley last year everyone I know that has a Harley told me NOT to get a Sportster no matter what and by the looks of it, they were right. Seems like anyone that has one has hardly any miles on it and can't even give it away. Everyone knows that if you constantly want to have your bike in the shop or if you constantly want to break down, you'll buy a Harley. The only bike I've heard of that has any exceptional reliability is the VROD, because it's the only modern bike in the Harley lineup. Not offering any customization & accessories for the Buell when that is basically the Harley trademark, cancelling Buell rather than trying to sell, and adding 9 more Old Tired variances to an already Bloated lineup is testimonial that Harley has no idea what they're doing and my hope is that they completely tank once & for all. They've been in business too long and their ego has gotten the best of them this time.

 

[ghost96b69]

There are 708 Harley Davidson Motorcycles on e-bay Nationwide with less than 5000 miles & less than 5 years old.
156 are Sportsters - 22%
95 are Dyna's - 13%
194 are Softails - 27%
164 are Touring bikes - 23%
49 are VRSC - 7%
Another 50 are miscellaneous - made up of every type of Harley the seller just didn't classify correctly.

I'd actually like to research what percentage of the MSRP the listed bikes are going for on average as well. Then you'd really see where the problems are, and it's not with Buell. There is ONE Buell with less than 5k miles between the years of 04-09 on e-bay and it's $4900.. If you want a Harley you can find one on any street corner for sale.. You have to search & wait for a Buell. Good luck Harley Davidson.. Sales are down 85% and it's not Buell's fault.. Something else is going on.. and I think I've illustrated what it is.

 

[wokor2wheel]

Ghost your bored aren't you? No I'm sorry by the looks of your current study. You are deep in thought. I'm sorry that you think Harley Banged your mother and spit on your kid. I really am. But the truth is or the Fact is Buell as of this moment is no more. Maybe they will bring it back with a different business model and products that more people will like and buy. And then, maybe then you can take the tin foil off your head and say there is a GOD. But for your sake. our sake I hope it doesn't have a Harley sticker on it, because we will never hear the end of it. Now take your medz and get some sleep. BOO Boy

 

[fishgutz]

Wok and Ghost, you guys just need to whip 'em out and show who has the bigger ........

 

[wokor2wheel]

You know what? I love the ad for the Sportster Iron you see pop up from time to time on this forum. LOL

 

[rndrkeagle]

ok.. both of you back up to your respective corners and take the gloves off... there's no point in turning this into a pissing match... comparing the lengths of your junk for us all to watch.

You both have very valid points.. lose the insults and we've got us a good little debate here..

for what it's worth... just my little 2 cents.. I don't know that I would say that Harley WANTED Buell to fail... but I would say they didn't really set them up for success. Moreover, in the end.. I just think that Harley was a bad company to OWN Buell. They are just too different in fundamental application. People don't go to Harley Davidson dealerships to buy a sport bike. They may LEAVE with one... but for the most part, they went in there to look at cruisers and touring bikes. Anyone who doesn't know Buell like we owners do, or have a friend that owns one, has never heard of Buell and for that I DO blame Harley and the dealership network... but in the end... there are very few people that ever went into a Harley dealer to buy a Buell... (those that did... are here arguing with each other about the price of tea in China!)

To the vast majority of the Sport bike owners out there.. HD Dealers are the last place they'd be caught dead in. To the American public... going to a Harley dealer for a Sport bike would be on par with going to a Hummer Dealership to buy an Exotic Italian Sports Car. and a significant part of the blame for that definitely goes back to Harley and the dealership network because Marketing and Advertising are the ONLY way to change that fact.

 

[ghost96b69]

I don't get the tin hat thing, and I'm an Atheist, there is no God, that was a bedtime story that someone took seriously..

Looks like I touched on reality Wok, sorry to show you that Harley isn't as strong & in demand as you thought it was. Keagle is absolutely right, Harley owning Buell was supposed to be an American Company taking another American Company and having some pride in diversifying their offering. Instead they just gave Buell a corner in their Old Fart Motorcycle shop to occupy and expected them to do their thing somehow.. They didn't really care what happened with Buell. They must've really got a good deal when they bought Buell, not to care what happens, not to promote the product or accessorize, and then to just cancel them rather than try to sell them off. I'd think they got Buell for free based on what I've seen this past week and what I know about how Harley deals with Buell customers and owners. You're a joke man, you can refer to meds or whatever you'd like but the fact of the matter is, I make six figures and live 7 blocks from the Beach in Southern California, you work is a crappy Harley dealership in Michigan.. You do the math. Nothing you can say could take anything away from me or make me feel bad.. sorry. I've got my Buell and I just sold my VROD and I will never buy another Harley Davidson. I'll get a custom chopper for the same price rather than a dressed up POS. And my HOG membership is on it's way back to HD so they can cram it up their cram hole.

 

[1stxb9r]

the whole idea of the iron and some of the other "lower" priced bikes Harley is coming out with is the reason that Buell is no more. Harley doesn't want you to spend 10k on a new Buell when you can get an iron or Nightster at the same price. The end of Buell is nothing more than business, but for us that own and love Buell it is so much more.

 

[rndrkeagle]

oh... not to change the subject... ok well yes... to change the subject...

This... has got to be the absolute UGLIEST bike I've ever seen!

 

[wokor2wheel]

Ghost I don't care if you do make six figures or live near a beach. What does that prove. Nothing! Fact is your pissed as hell that someone took your Buell away and you blame Harley. Fine blame Harley all you want. If you think your so smart why didn't you see that Buell was going under. Why did you save it. Looking at your in depth thinking I blame you for not call Erik or Willie G and tell them what they should be doing. You ever hear the old saying "hind sight is always 20/20"
Here is a good example. Now are you going to sit there in front of your laptop pissing and moaning that you will never buy a Harley ever again or are you going to do something about it. Some one with your level of income must know someone to get the capital together to buy the company to pay the workers, turn the lights on and make it happen. That's right get the 180 people in E. Troy WI back on the payroll!! It all boils down to this. Who is still in business? Harley not Buell. Should Harley have owned Buell? Maybe. Maybe not. Could things been different? Sure they could have. The Buell I like is the 1125CR.
Sure it was different and weird. But it hauled ass and thats what was great about it. There are different bikes for different people. I don't see any one bike that can make every single person happy. But unless you can raise the dead Buell is no more. You can point the finger at who should take the wrap. Blame the dealers, salesman, tech's, the lady cleaning the floor, HOG, people on Sportsters, the homeless guy you will probably kick when you see he has a HD hat on. But thats ok. the sun will rise in the morning and life will go on.

 

[wokor2wheel]

Here is something to sleep on Ghost. Why did Erik crush the blast?

 

[wokor2wheel]

Kind of like the father beating his child with a bat and saying it's ok.

 

[SylvanSlayer]

I think that Buell is not for sale for 2 reasons Eric Buell would rather shut it down than have H-D sell it, witch could mean that he wouldn't have anything to buell anymore. Also I read on the inertnet that Buells where made in H-D factorys so thier was nothing to sell but the name.

Another thing it wouldn't be the first time H-D went bankrupt, the almost where done 3 times before. Luckly someone saved them each time. I think H-D has no idea what they are doing, they spent a ton of money to buy Buell remake all the bikes in 2003 then in 2008 make 1125 platform, and buy MV Augsta. So they spent all this money on sport bike companys just to sell MV Augsta and shut Buell down. SOUNDS REALLY DUMB to me. That why all these company are in deep shit in the states, thet have no idea how to run a company, they couldn't organize a rock fight in a gravel pit. Don't get me wrong I love my uly.

 

[ghost96b69]

I am pissed, of course, and it's not MY Buell - It's Harley's Buell and I don't have connections in the Motorcycle business - my business is plasma fusion & electricity - the people I deal with know nothing about Motorcycles and don't want to. Harley does know about Motorcycles but what they don't know about is Buell or I should say anything that isn't Harley Davidson.. That is their only goal and it was apparent to me before this ridiculous decision to add 9 new models & cancel Buell?! Sales are down 85% oh, great, let's cut Buell & add 9 new models that don't sell.. that sounds great.. What, were they all drunk in Daytona when they made this decision?! They say now without Buell they can emphasize Harley Davidson?! When did they stop emphasizing Harley Davidson?! When did they even touch on Buell?! My ability to affect change is in the numbers I can generate against Harley Davidson in the defense of Buell. Seems to me even people who work at Harley Davidson & Buell can't get through to Willie G so what possible affect would I have by myself. I need numbers not money, I need support not Capital.. There is no better company to own & distribute Buell and the parts & accessories needed to make them succeed, but Harley Davidson needs to own it and believe in it and they never did that. That is why they are making a Stupid decision to cancel Buell. That's the way I see it.

 

[mpolans]

New Harley mandated ad campaign.

> Here is something to sleep on Ghost. Why did Erik crush the blast?

 

[ghost96b69]

Why should I know or care about the Buell Blast?! I know that Harley was using the blast as their demo bike for the rider training program they do. I have no idea why they cancelled the blast. I completely understand simplifying & down-sizing, but I do not understand cancelling a company & adding 9 tired old same old models with new bells & whistles.. I could care less about the blast..

 

[ghoward]

wow got into this late but my 2$ worth bought my first HD in 83 new it was an 80 with sun faded paint on one side of the tank 4999 if i remember right.[smirk]

 

[okey]

wokor2wheel you asked to detail my poor sales experience so for those that dont care i am sorry and i will make it as short as i can.Ok here goes.Been buying mags and keeping up with bikes after having a child and selling previous Gpz750.Found a pic of an Xb12stt and loved it ,funds were being saved as i researched all about Buells especially the Xb12ss cherry translucent.Decided i wanted this bike right or wrong after 18 months saving and a generous wife i became cashed up.Found out old work mate was service adviser at HD dealer.sent email and requested booklet and arranged to meet salesman next saturday after morning work.I was asked at the door if i needed help and was directed to the salesman that sent booklet.He was stitching up a deal and i patiently waited for 1.5 hrs to see him.He beckoned me to follow while he went outside to grab a steak sandwich.After he was finished eating he walked me through the w/shop and pointed at a uly and said have a sit on that its red also.We sat at his desk and he fiddled around with his pc clicking on this pic that pic till he found a xb12ss. Quoted retail price of aust $15995 + on roads.Total $17500. I said throw in a jacket and i will pay a deposit today as they didnt carry the bike in stock.He said ohhh umm cant do a jacket $600 bucks but took $200 off price.Could not tell me how long for bike to arrive but would call monday.paid 1k deposit and no call monday.I rang wednesday but nope still no go and sales would call friday.No call and i left it 2 weeks.I rang again and still nothing .Went to launch of 09 HD's (mate had invite)salesman avoided me till i cornered him.Said would call next monday but didnt.I left it another 2 weeks then went to HD store again (2 hr drive away) after salesman said he had a hero blue one arrive.I wanted to at least sit on one but when i arrived bike was still in crate.I was fuming.was told they couldnt get a date off harley for my bikes arrival but as it had been 2 months should be soon.I waited 2 weeks and after phoning again told dunno by salesman.I fkn hit the roof.One phone call the next day to rival HD dealer on other side of city and i was told they had a cherry Xb12ss on the floor(i had already given my ph number to this dealer twice before and they through normal order got a bike and didnt call me).I again rang salesman and told him to fuck off and give me my money back as i found one at another dealer of which he said he already had checked for on his pc.bullshit he had. Funny thing happened .sales rang and said my bike was arriving tuesday.I rang tuesday but bike not there.Bike arrived thursday.I said i will pick bike up Saturday and wanted vin number to arrange insurance.Arranged my insurance and organised lift for Saturday..Couldnt wait.was asked by salesman to arrive early as he had lots of deliveries to do.I was there before store opened and was let in.Another salesman said bike looked gr8 and wheeled it out of tight space.Bike was not registered.A few heated words and my bike gets wheeled back away.i waited for 3 fkn hours as they had the wrong fkn vin number on the rego papers and hence my insurance.Finally got a plate on it and insurance sorted.He handed me my backpack and all papers and stood there.I said so is that it ? where is the handover? show me my tools and give me some idea of service details and where i return for service .What cleaners do u recommend ? He tried to get the seat off but couldnt.Back in the workshop where a kid was shrugging.After 20 minutes in the baking sun the bike returned with the seat half off as salesman showed me toolkit and said seat would have to be adjusted 1st service.I said i cant wait to get your "how was the service letter" and rode off.I have never experienced such a bunch of pricks in my life and have had better service buying a fkn pizza from a gas station. the end..